SL-Mark:  pretty please 

Artful Dodger: Say Pretty Please

(V):  And those other ways are?

Czuch: Pardon?? It was a simple question...

Look and see.

Artful Dodger: No. I wouldn't need to. Other ways to get info without the need for torture. A certain police force use it quite often

(V): What are you asking me this for anyway??? Please give me some reference for me to get perspective?

(V):  You'd use it if it was the only way to protect your family.  We all would.  We're not dealing with nuns here.   Terrorists.  they play hardball. 

Czuch: Czuch ... do you know waterboarding means??

I suggest you take a look at some demonstration videos on youtube. Where people agree to see what it feels like.

And using water torture (as I quoted) was considered a crime by the USA. What's changed??

Imsoaddicted: I've heard of such rubbish being said. It's a damn right disgrace!! I'm glad that most ignore that garbage. The man (or woman) in the street doesn't care. Plain and simple. And as far as I'm concerned breaks the law!! There is rules as such to prevent such stupidity under the religious freedom org that about 99% of all faiths and churches have signed.

I hope the day that the OTT crowd get their way ends soon. As far as I'm concerned the sooner the better. Extremes are always bad!

Tuesday: You have a better idea??? Maybe force people with a roof to have people without one move in with them?

I think at least in jail they have shelter and 3 meals and access to other resources for when they are to be released

Doesnt sound great, but neither does living out of a shopping cart under a bridge

(V): That is the point when suffering can occur.


Thats hog wash.... its like saying that if I kill you in your sleep, therefore no suffering, then it is okay???

Good luck with the false academic who depend on the industry and reproduce their lies. The green revolution is a lie, there are no crops from a labor that saves the world from starvation, it is a LIE, it doesn't work. Good luck with these fake academics, out of the universities with them, the money they earn is your money, given to them to reproduce lies to give you that comfy feeling they call life... Good luck in your reality, your reality is a lie.

(V): i remember being in a room on pogo.com on Christmas day and being told off by someone for wishing everyone in the room a Happy Christmas
it wasn't ethical to do that anymore i was told

80 % of the pharmaceutic products most usually take for tons of money can be replaced on a 5 mile walk aroud each ones home instead of buying it from companies who robbed the knowledge. Good luck in your comfy lives, nourished by the illusion of big money, waste and abuse. I for my part go collecting herbs, if I had to I'd get my food ready until next spring this week. Good luck hard working 'real lifers', I don't understand your ways.

Imsoaddicted: Tell me about it!! It's getting that in some cases that you can't be honest in telling your feelings in description these days. Even though the same crowd that says you can't uses their version as such which breaks the rules they say we have to live by!!

(V): the world has gone crazy

Imsoaddicted: Blame the 'PC' crowd! So many of what I call descriptive words are taken as being insults these days rather then being plain descriptions.

Some people just get upset to easily and we have to pay the price.
It would be far better for them to be told to grow up and stop being so insecure!!

(V): Domestic science is considered (in the saying, not the act) sexist

thats so stupid ive never heard about that till now ive got to ask the question why

Imsoaddicted: Domestic science is considered (in the saying, not the act) sexist I think.. But yes, from my experience home skills are still taught.

And like you, me and me better other half were taught how to cook, and we teach that to our siblings.

I even make our rice puddings (two types) as even the hob only type is far better then what in shops you can buy (unless you pay a fortune) for a fraction of the cost with ten times the quality.

It's the little extras that count

(V): yes but from what i understand basic common sense has flown outta the window
we didnt have this problem in the sixties
i was taught to bake from an early age and still do it now even thou im by myself

do they actually have domestic science lessons in schools today?

they have lessons for grown ups up here to teach them the basic skills on food. so makes me wonder why wasnt it taught to them earlier in there life

gogul: We have as well... It's called fair trade decent income...and fast becoming the established norm.

Imsoaddicted: Not in our family we are not. But it's a taught thing either way.

(V)</b but you have to agree we are now a nation of wasters sadly
an ever growing amount of ppl in the UK eat junk food on a daily buisness

we live in a throw away society and have done since the late 50s

we fast becomming a must have nation to esp the children

I see a world without big banking, without raping food suppliers, without abusing pharma. It's there in front of me. Good luck in your trashlife.

gogul: Such figures though since the recession are to be far from accurate. Less money to waste = less food to waste.

Shops now stock less perishables as they know they can't sell so much.

(V): But I know about Nestle, a other of these nasty swiss companies...

gogul: Every single Swiss is better then every other person educationally in the world??

I better tell Steven to stop publishing and teaching... and oxford and cambridge to close their doors!!

Übergeek 바둑이: I noted down my comment from the radio, but didn't catch the autor of the book discussed. I think the title is something like: uncover the food scandal or similar, a new book. So ... I've no idea what I was talking about

Übergeek 바둑이: Who on earth is wasting our proportion then!! We waste very little, even leftovers from meals we re-use as much as possible.. A dog is a great waste recycler!!

(V): Shows how little you know about Swiss, the best educated people of the world.

Dumping of food as a way to manipulate prices is not new and it goes back through history back to Roman times and probably even earlier. Dumping of food as waste has been used as a way to maintain high prices and the 20th century saw a lot of it, specially in the late 1970s and 1980s when there was deflation in world commodity prices.

There is a general article on Wikipedia with regards to food waste:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Food_waste

According to that article in the UK about 17.6% of the food ends as waste, while in the US 14-15% has been estimated. The situation in many other industrialized countries is not much better. It is terrible considering that one of the latest UN reports estimated that nearly 848 million people in the world are malnourished.

http://www.fao.org/newsroom/common/ecg/1000923/en/hungerfigs.pdf

gogul: Maybe I don't sense humour in your posts.

(V): Dude! Your lack of humor is untypical for Brits

gogul: failed?? That's your opinion and your problem if you believe that!!

Imsoaddicted: EU laws!! But smart local shops know their customers and as I mentioned before will apply common sense and give to their regulars what they know is safe.

It's worked good for us... each month I recon it's given us about £20 in still good products.

Saffron.. Vanilla sugar... Sweets.. etc..

(V): Yes, do the best to defend your failed country. I have to do with mine for a while.

(V): what bugs me is why the hell do we need sell by dates on such things has TEA BAGS

Imsoaddicted: I thin also they have to consider how long it'll take to get to the homeless people... It can be an additional waste on energy (fuel,etc) transferring food around on the hope they might get it those who need it.

Shame.. but sometimes it's just not economic or safe to donate some food products.

Übergeek 바둑이: Tartar sauce.. I make at home!!

gogul: No. Again you show how little you know us Brits.

And it's not all cheap food, many items are expensive but necessary for good cooking and a good diet.

And much "waste" we compost and reuse in growing next years home grown crop of veg and fruit... and if you have the space.. to feed animals such as pigs.

Übergeek 바둑이: The fish and chips in paper please, not plastic.

gogul: i will agree with you on one bit of that post

i was once at my local council incinerater dropping of things that where to big for normal refuse collection
and i noticed large vans comming in and dumping their loads of cakes biscuits etc
having done some work with the homeless so asked one of the drivers why they were doing this
and his reply amazed me
they had a couple of days left on them before sell by date expired and it was cheaper and easier to dump them than to gave them to the local homeless charities

Fish and chips recipe:
Take haddock (or another nice fish). Dip it in batter and fry it deeply. Take potato pieces and fry them deeply. Serve with vinegar or even better, tartar sauce (the real stuff based on mayonaisse).

All that oil might be considered junk food, but my taste buds disagree. It certainly beats tofu with brussel sprouts!

(V): Your "we import so much" doesnt rebut what I wrote. Poor people in GB buy their food rather when it soon expires, when it's cheap. This is the British system, cheap food, and waste. This is a global problem btw a real problem a huge one.

"........

United States law

The United States Supreme Court in Sosa v. Alvarez-Machain, said that the Universal Declaration of Human Rights "does not of its own force impose obligations as a matter of international law."[164] However, the United States has a historical record of regarding water torture as a war crime, and has prosecuted as war criminals individuals for the use of such practices in the past.

In 1947, the United States prosecuted a Japanese civilian who had served in World War II as an interpreter for the Japanese military, Yukio Asano, for "Violation of the Laws and Customs of War," asserting that he "did unlawfully take and convert to his own use Red Cross packages and supplies intended for" prisoners, but, far worse, that he also "did willfully and unlawfully mistreat and torture" prisoners of war. Asano received a sentence of 15 years of hard labor.[105] The charges against Asano included "beating using hands, fists, club; kicking; water torture; burning using cigarettes; strapping on a stretcher head downward."[165] The specifications in the charges with regard to "water torture" consisted of "pouring water up [the] nostrils" of one prisoner, "forcing water into [the] mouths and noses" of two other prisoners, and "forcing water into [the] nose" of a fourth prisoner.[166]

..........."

gogul: shows how little you know about us Brits!!

(V): No rubbish. Junkfood is a normal dish for Brits, for Swiss it is junk.

Those three times of waterboarding....

That's what the CIA admitted they had done, there is evidence that it might have happened before Bush sanctioned it!! Therefore how can it be said (seeing as the CIA hides a lot of things) they only did it three times?

Many things in the CIA have done yet not admitted to until someone has blown the whistle on them.

Especially as it is not 3 times, but ON THREE DETAINEES!!
The actual number of times that actual waterboarding was carried out on those admitted 3 people ... and on one person such actions were carried out over 80 times!!!

... According to your Justice dept!

(V):  Oh well