Czuch Chuckers: Quite right. I was away for 5 days and fell in about 15 ponds. Since I've only played about 80 that's significant.

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Czuch Chuckers: Yea, as far as I can remember, I have fallen in more than 50 ponds due to not being able to get on-line.

How do I create these and prevent non Fellowship members from playing here?

Skyking: Short answer is you can't.

Long answer:

(1) Make sure you put something like "(Fellowship members only)" in the TITLE. If you just put it in the description, some will miss it.

(2) Then before it starts, you will have to go through manually and remove any non-members who signed up - since there is no way to automaticly do it. (So also don't do a dark pond since you can't see who signs up)

Czuch Chuckers: Your very correct on that issue,in my eyes alot of time outs are due to having to go around the boards and defend yourself,big time shame due to the harrassment and ignorance of other members.

BBW great idea you are very intellegent.

Universal Eyes: I suggest you play first, chat second. I can't imagine why you'd time out because you were writing a message on a board.... oops gotta rush before I time out...

BIG BAD WOLF: Regarding fellowships,if you have a fellowship,no one outside the fellowships are allowed to join,so there is no need to erase them,due to fact they can't join.

Universal Eyes: I can join any pond I want, as well as everyone else...

Universal Eyes: anyone can join a fellowship pond...it is up to the BigBoss of f/s to "erase" the non members.

There is a person (Foxy Lady is the nick I think) whose pond rating is 2155. In any game here at BK, safe for ponds, 2155 means the holder of this high BKR is very good at the game. Now I want you to see this: there is a pond where Foxy Lady bet these amounts of points:

Round 1: 1116
Round 2: 2525
Round 3: 3000
Round 4: 3005
Round 5: 125 (here, I would like to point out that it was lindaw4 who fell in the pond in this round with a bet of 117)
Round 6: 1116
Round 7: 2225
Round 8: 2500
Round 9: 2510 (the second highest bet in this round was 992)

Based on this and based on the number of ponds she's finished (more than 70), I dare to say that Foxy Lady is the worst pond player I have seen playing at BK and that she doesn't deserve to be rated that high. Something must be done with the rating system in my opinion.
This is not meant to sound personal against Foxy Lady, I just want the ratings to be "just" and reflecting the players' skills

Pedro Martínez: Hear hear. I'm tired of ponds where the bonus is effectively taken out of the game by players who clearly have no interest in winning the pond. And there are more than one of them.

I think the run in the rain somewhat addresses it. :)

I really think that the ratings should take into account how far from the lead you are each round. Of course final position should count more, but it should be a hyperbolic function so that the difference between 1st and 5th is much more than the difference between 5th and 9th for example.

Pedro Martínez: Look at this pond

http://brainking.com/pt/Pond?g=659

Andre Faria: That's just unbelievable. She's more probably going to lose BKR in that pond...*shaking head*

Pedro Martínez: Yep, because there were 39 players on that pond. If there were only 16, she probably would end at 6th /7th and perhaps she would win some BKR points.

http://brainking.com/en/Ratings
number of rated pond players = 2 ????

grenv: Wha Wha Wha..... what are you guys complaining about, really? What do you want, someone to leave you the bonus with a 400 bet everytime? Its obvious that to be a high rated player in this game, you do not have to actually be able to win very often. Thats just the nature of a multi player game, I guess.

Im gonna stick with Lindaw4 as my all time worst p[ond player though....

Czuch Chuckers: you mean that a consistant bet of 108 isn't a good strategy?

I have an idea for fixing this flaw Perdo. I acll them % ponds.. here you must stay with the "Pack" and make reasonable bets if not you lose points at a higher rate (or your points deteriorate)here is an example:

player last bet
Pedro 12000 303
Czuch 11983 340
Thad 11976 400
Vikings 11950 276
Rabbitoid 11875 450
Faria 11609 365
Nothing.. 11674 402
BBWolf 11590 390
Foxy Lady 5009 5009
LindaW 4006 4999

now at this point in my make believe pond. The following round any person(s) who is not within 1000 pts (changing each rd depending upon the amount of participants remaining) of the pack loses 1000Pts each rd. OR have them eliminated immediately. this will keep it close. Now another example is that in the 1st rd, most people are generally betting 30-100pts they will all be fine BUT anyone betting over 700pts will be eliminated or likei said severly fined rd fine 4000pts rd2 fine 3000pts rd3 fine 2000pts etc....

I'M also noticing that he Rain ponds are very competetive. and much tougher to find a betting system( very unpredictable).

I think that people are fine betting anyway they like, that is the rules of the game.
What I'd like to see is a ratings system that is similar to the rating system that nascar has, 5 bonus points for leading a round, 1 st place x points second place x-3 points third place x-6 points, 4th place x-10 points, 5th place x-15 points and so on

Czuch Chuckers: Don't be silly, when these players aren't involved the bonus comes into play, generally at around 400-600 above the lower bets.

In the first round 400 is a risky bet. 550 is more likely to get the bonus, but you might as well bet 50. Of course you deny the bonus to someone else. 1000+ is stupid, there's no way around it.

Vikings: I see what you mean and I sort of like it but instead of giving points to players for each round, I would rather advantage the top X (3?) finishers.

Pedro Martínez: Points each round would be a good variation though. The winner wouldn't be the last standing, but the player with the most "points" at the end. Of course the last round counts so being in at the end would be an advantage.

maybe I didn't explain it very good, the bonus points only go to one player per round, the x, x-3,x-6 is the scoring at the end but you wou would then add their bonus, and the edge for being in first - third is that there is a much less drop than say 10th place which might be something like x-100

or if we based the scoring on a x=2700 point system, 10th place might be something like x-950 or 1750

Nothingness: the idea of limiting the bets to a certain area around the average bet sounds nice ..... but i dont like it for one reason ... when i go on a holiday i like to place a bet to what i expect the bets to be when i return from my trip .. i did this for a bit more than 1 week in february and didnt drop in any pond (got the bonus in a few of them of course, so i didnt even drop back a lot in points) .. when you have stay within a certain limit .. you cant stay in a pond while you are away for some time (planned ahead)

i like it better when the top players only get points .. like in the F1 (or the eurovision song contest, but then without the voting system ;))

http://brainking.com/en/Pond?g=738

Looks like 9719 is the ideal bid here.

grenv: My point is that there is no given standard for the pond games... On my first ever move of the first ever game on this site, I wasnt sure if 100 would be high enough or 500 or 1000. Turned out to be 10! Now it is something like 40 or so to be safe. Had more peole been like me and bid 100 in the first round of that game, than maybe 140 would be a low first round bid right now. WQwe just dont know. It would probably be completely different game if a whole new group of newbie were to start playing right now, without any past experience to help them.

Point is, there is no wrong move in this game except he one that puts you into the pond! Every other move is as legit as any of yours are. Just because someone doesnt play the way you think they should or the way you would like them to, doesnt matter. Someday maybe 1000 wil be a poor first bet in this game! Youm just dont know how it will evolve, and it is still evolving for sure. Best thing you can do is quit complaining and try to take advantage of these "poor" moves and players :)

Czuch Chuckers: Ok, apparently you have an irony deficiency.

Czuch Chuckers: 1000 opening bid as a standard is an illogical bid, especcialy if there are more than 20 people in it. imho

Czuch Chuckers: I don't understand why you're speaking about "someday". Speak about what is now, i.e. people who know how other people that have been kinda successful in this game bet and still they show no will to end up in the top positions, but despite that having very high ratings that do not correspond to their results. Don't speak about newbies, don't speak about what will be someday, don't speak about ifs. Speak about what we're seeing at present.

There is no-one who is speaking up for/supporting the present ratings system. It is patently useless, because it penalises players who are without internet access for a short time.
Most of us want a ratings system that rewards finishing in high places (say, 1st thru 5th).
may we not try this out or at least, have a ratings system based on final positions alongside?

Pedro Martínez: I think that if you are playing for ratings and you can figure out a way to get higher ratings, even if it is a different way than you approve of, it is totally appropriate way to play this game!

Whats the big deal with the bonus anyway????? Just dont go for it, there is no need to ever get a bonus to win this game and get a high rating.... let those people scalp themselves and try to put yourself in a position to be in first place when they end up with very few points left, then yu will have an easy win.

Vikings..... I know you are one of the top players, so me giving you advice is what it is, but I dont think any move in this game is ilogivcal if it keeps you in the game for another round! I understand that it is not a good long term strategy to bid so high that you will not have enough points to finish the game with a win. But it is obvious that winning isnt necessarily the best strategy for a high BKR.

I just dont think that there are any wrong bets in this game, except the one that puts you in the pond. I realize that how we bet early will have an impact on our play in later rounds. But if you dont make it through round 1, then what does it matter?

Also the amount of plaers that start a game will in part determine the strategy for that game, so a 16 person game is definatly different than a 25 person game. The bigger the starting pool, the more important it is to get an early lead, and to be in first place when the lower players begin to run out of points.

Czuch Chuckers: That is clearly incorrect. In move 1 you cann guarantee staying in the game by bidding 500, you may even get the bonus for a net zero.

1000+ is a bad bet. Period. You are guaranteed to be worse off than if you bet 500 with no more chance of staying in.

Czuch Chuckers: agreed, but it is illogical if you want any chance of winning, if all you want is 6th place or worse its fine

grenv: All am saying is that if everyone bets over 1000 in the first round except for you, then you are in the drink. Its not impossible....

Vikings... point is that people are not playing for first place anymore, they are playing for bkr. Point in case.... was the 4tgh person on this site with 10 or more wins, and soon had 11. Since the bkrs first came out, I have not won a single game, I am still at 11 wins and my bkr has gone up!

Czuch Chuckers: And if everyone in china jumps up and down at the same time the earth will change it's orbit?

It is practically impossible since it's never happened. Why do you continue to argue for stupid moronic bids???

as I see it, the end game for "the very first run" is only 3 moves away from starting

grenv: I am not for moronic bids, but I think it is just part of the game and something that you can use to your advantage. Why does it hurt you so much to not be able to get a bonus? It doesnt matter, its just aseasy to do well without ever even thinking about the bonus. Just dont worry about moronic players, and when you spot them ina game, just plan on being in first place when they begin to run out of points to play with. Moronic players just make the end game easier for whomever is in the lead!

grenv:We shall see when A WHAM BAMS Pondside of points!!! reveals his own mathamatical conclussion.

It's very simple but does not allow other players to drop 1 or 2 bids to allow others a higher rating,that is for sure they will only hurt themselfs,so that's when there going to say NO WAY!
Oh BTW there is still some positions left for the latest ponds be quick they fill up fast,which made me decide to expand to 20 rather then the basic 16,alot more complex to the volume of minipulation of the games.

Czuch Chuckers: Of course when those players are in the game I wouldn't go for the bonus. However I think the bonus adds something to the game, and when it is taken away by idiotic bids it lessens the game.

If everyone tried their best to win, or even tried their best to improve their rating, such bids wouldn't happen.

Czuch Chuckers: I don't care about the bonuses, definitely not in the first rounds. All I want is an alteration of the BKR system so that people making "idiotic" bets weren't rated that high...

This table is compiled by ranking players on a percentage of games won basis. To be eligible players must have won at least 2 ponds.
The number of wins figures link to a list of the tournaments won and BKR ratings link to a graph of their history. Only completed ponds are included.


Rank…..Played ..........Won ........…….......... Rating

..1 ............16 ................6 ..........37.5%.......... 2572P.................. Mike UK
..2 ............24 ................7 ..........29.2%.......... 2700P.................. basplund
..3 ..........399 ..............81 ..........20.3%.......... 2482.................... Pedro Martínez
..4 ............85 ..............16 ..........18.8%.......... 2552.................... furbster
..5 ..........367 ..............68 ..........18.5%.......... 2700.................... Vikings
..6 ............11 ................2 ..........18.2%.......... 2086P.................. MariaAnna
..7 ............20 ................3 ..........15.0%.......... 2196P.................. Hanis
..8 ............28 ................4 ..........14.3%.......... 2552.................... RadRx
..9 ............29 ................4 ..........13.8%.......... 2351.................... Luisifer
10 ............29 ................4 ..........13.8%.......... 2700.................... Matarilevich
11 ..........277 ..............35 ..........12.6%.......... 2252.................... Maxxina
12 ..........277 ..............31 ..........11.2%.......... 2333.................... BIG BAD WOLF
13 ............27 ................3 ..........11.1%.......... 2179.................... TIGER0005
14 ..........133 ..............14 ..........10.5%.......... 2497.................... rabbitoid
15 ............19 ................2 ..........10.5%.......... 1936P.................. NOT a floosie
16 ............39 ................4 ..........10.3%.......... 2533.................... zockerdotcom
17 ............59 ................6 ..........10.2%.......... 2477.................... aissi
18 ..........111 ..............11 ............9.9%.......... 2311.................... Czuch Chuckers
19 ..........102 ..............10 ............9.8%.......... 2285.................... Flake
20 ............31 ................3 ............9.7%.......... 1970.................... Sinay
21 ............94 ................9 ............9.6%.......... 2311.................... Andre Faria
22 ............33 ................3 ............9.1%.......... 2228.................... jitkasafa
23 ............22 ................2 ............9.1%.......... 2627P.................. Jannssen
24 ............71 ................6 ............8.5%.......... 2058.................... Erinity
25 ............36 ................3 ............8.3%.......... 2544.................... Mely

Mike UK: hahahahaha
Ive won 3 i think and im not even there.....at the moment im 2382 and Ive just been demoted from the lower 2400's because of finishing 7th in a pond :(......how come????

BerniceC: because your winning percentage is less than 8.3%, you didn't make the top 25. Thats all that this system measures

Vikings: Ta very much...

Talk about some close biddin.. hehe

http://brainking.com/en/Pond?g=699

Good game to whoever is in 2nd..

I have a question.. do you have to have any points to win a pond game??

for instance say you are down to the last two players and the scores look like this..

1. 343
2. 342

obviously to win player one would have to bid 343 to make sure he had the highest bid.. but, he is then left with 0 points.. does he still win??

ScarletRose: Yes, the person who bids 343 will be the winner. Actually they will have 500 points left at the end since they will earn the bonus.