(V): Nice bait and switch. When you're losing an argument, it's only natural that you'd try to "fix" things. But in my original post I CLEARLY said cable news.

"Fox is the number one cable news program in the US for TEN years and it will only continue to climb. MSNBC is in the pits and CNN is second by way down on the list. I love that people whine about Fox but that FOX is the most popular cable network anywhere. Oh yeah, Bill O'Reilly smashes the competition in his time slot all the time. Most Fox programs dominate. Even the liberals love to watch Fox."

This is the fact you tried to dispute. Now you're changing things because you have no case.

(V): And CBS is DEAD LAST in news ratings. Fox is number one. Did I mention that it's been number one for TEN YEARS???

Artful Dodger: You said Fox... you quoted a certain % of the population.

btw.. where was I baiting?

"FOX is the most popular cable network anywhere."

Fox news is just 3 million max at out 99 million viewers. So 96 million are watching other things.

It has created a niche as a conservative network per Murdoch's schemes.

(V): CBS isn't a cable network. And in my original post, I said "Fox is the number one cable news program in the US for TEN years"

When one refers to Fox cable they are talking news because that's all fox runs on that network. Fox cable differs from it's regular network.

No...

Politics (Artful Dodger, 2012-01-30 16:29:07)
Politics (Artful Dodger, 2012-01-31 16:15:30)
Politics (Artful Dodger, 2012-02-01 05:35:32)

Politics (Artful Dodger, 2012-02-01 05:35:32)

This in itself is wrong even if stiscking to Fox news. The others DO pull in millions.

(V): FOX in America is a registered entertainment service not a media outlet.

(V): You just don't like the fact that Fox is the number one new cable program beating out all others including the regular networks. CBS is dead last. Facts are stubborn things.

Jack: We just lump them all into one. The BBC is a broadcaster, it has several channels showing different programs. Two, are aimed at news and politics with the news as well as opinion and interviews, ITV .. the same. C4 .. the same, Sky.... the same (Murdoch owned broadcaster) ... and we go on.

Sky, C4, BBC, ITV are all classed as broadcasters. Some use cable, some through fibre, some through satellite, some via aerial and then there is their internet sites, showing films, making films, new shows, news, cookery, and various repeats, series links, games, competitions, bingo (we are British!!), cleaning tips (how to make your own cleaners), consumer information, etc, etc, etc.

... But regardless of whether it is a subsidiary in name.. such as a builders I did the accounts for who had one central company and several subsidiary companies.. In the end. It all ends up one one central accounts report, as they are all owned by that one main business. This is law, legal, financial and 9 tenths... that is.. 9 tenths of the law is to do with property in it's various versions...eg fixed and liquid assets, depreciation, contracts, etc.

Also..
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-14030051


Hope it shows

Artful Dodger: But it is not one program.

2. February 2012, 18:33:29
Live + Same Day Cable News Daily Ratings for Tuesday, February 1, 2012
P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
Total Day
FNC 1,190 317 565

CNN 409 135 174
MSNBC 490 123 213
CNBC 194 55 106
FBN 61 13 28
HLN 235 68 118

Primetime P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC 2,389 536 1,024

CNN 675 225 296
MSNBC 1,002 234 442
CNBC 265 93 112
FBN 51 16 30
HLN 398 82 199

Net Morning programs (6-9 AM) P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC FOX & Friends 1,039 323 584

CNN Early Start/Starting Point 217 87 107
MSNBC Morning Joe 419 149 216
CNBC Squawk Box 156 55 111
HLN Morning Express w/ Meade 246 106 144

Net 5PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC FIVE, THE 1,755 465 812

CNN Situation Room 583 119 179
MSNBC Hardball WITH C. MATTHEWS 830 146 280
CNBC FAST MONEY 235 41 109
HLN HLN SPECIAL REPORT 227 24 68

Net 6PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC SPECIAL RPT W/BRET BAIER 1,862 423 760

CNN John King USA 498 156 204
MSNBC POLITICS NATION 875 183 334
CNBC Mad Money 208 63 118
HLN Prime News 258 58 107

Net 7PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC The Fox Report W/S.SMITH 1,815 455 830

CNN ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT 440 180 209
MSNBC Hardball WITH C. MATTHEWS 981 257 437
CNBC Kudlow Report 168 54 90
HLN ISSUES 330 91 200

Net 8PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC THE OREILLY FACTOR 3,302 667 1,292

CNN Anderson Cooper 360 554 178 236
MSNBC Ed Show 1,045 231 458
CNBC M. ZUCKERBERG: INSIDE FB 227 64 96
HLN Nancy Grace 535 109 268

Net 9PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC Hannity 2,058 480 916

CNN Piers Morgan Tonight 819 266 360
MSNBC Rachel Maddow Show 1,054 249 470
CNBC AMERICAN GREED 313 116 115
HLN Dr. Drew 392 85 188

Net 10PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC ON THE RECORD W/GRETA 1,805 459 861

CNN Anderson Cooper 360 651 229 291
MSNBC Last Word W/ L. ODONNELL 903 220 396
CNBC AMERICAN GREED 256 99 125
HLN Nancy Grace 282 55 151

Net 11PM P2+ (000s) 25-54 (000s) 35-64 (000s)
FNC THE OREILLY FACTOR 1,226 463 675

CNN ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT 330 129 161
MSNBC Ed Show 557 117 264
CNBC Mad Money 152 86 99
HLN SHOWBIZ TONIGHT 361 128

FNC = Fox NEWS (news...get it??) Channel.

News

news

not sitcoms

news

it's always been about news

news = apples

apples to apples FNC kicks butt ALL DAY LONG



The others (especially CBS) --->

Jules you'd never survive the no spin zone.

Bernice: Great post. That bum has to go.

Bernice: You need to put up some figures FOX didn't spin off from Bush to Obama.

Austan Goolsbee says current recovery beats job creation record of George W. Bush recovery

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2011/jun/06/austan-goolsbee/austan-goolsbee-says-current-recovery-beats-job-cr/

Jack: Who gives a stuff about FOX....only one other it seems....I found those figures and put them there for AD to see.

Bernice: People like Jack just can't get over the fact that Fox is successful because it's fair and honest. So they like to attack it in as many ways as they can even to the point of making things up (see Jack's previous posts for examples).

Artful Dodger: Politics ((V), 2012-02-01 22:43:20)

Bernice: Oh no Obama is not Moses and can stop the momentum of a broken economy falling in 2 seconds flat. Especially with all those lobbyist groups saying "no no no"

Bernice: And those kinda figures are what's bad in the world. Distorted snapshots for people who they hope have no memory or education.

Here, we get educated to know you just can't stop a rolling stone the size of a medium mountain.

(V): He claimed he could

rod03801: .. 2 seconds... How many did McCain say?

Bernice:

Not all of the data in that chart is right. It was not collected by an independent monitor of the economy, and it is not corroborated. Just of the top of my head I can see the employment picture being wrong. The Bush administration finished with 9.9% unemployment. I know, because I follow the stock and futures markets and employment is one of the main movers of the financial markets. It says a lot that the graph is labelled "Mr. Conservative".

Artful Dodger:

> apples to apples FNC kicks butt ALL DAY LONG

Sounds like a great ad! Do you work for FNC, or hold stock in the company? That kidn of love comes only from somebody with a vested interest in FNC.

Well, of course, ratings is no indication of quality. Lots of people love MacDonald's. It does not mean that MacDonald's is good food, or nutritious food.

How should news be measured? Quality? Quantity? Popularity?

I find that if I want better news with more balanced reporting, then I have to see several channels to get a more complete picture. I never watch CNN or Fox. Simply because their view of the world is given through the narrow looking glass of American centrist and right-wing politics. It does not mean that they are bad networks. I just don't find their way of reporting appealing to me.

Likewise, I am sure the reporting in other channels leave a lot to be desired to other people. It is all colored by people's personal opinions.

I watch BBC News but I find a distinct pro-weswtern slant in their reporting. They are not left-leaning (as some people might want to believe). I find that they do chime of the neo-liberal ideology of modern western politics.

I watch RT (Russian television) news which has a less Eurocentric and Western-centric view. I find that they report much better in things that the western media tries to hide. A good example is their reporting of the rising sectarian violence in Lybia, something that western news media are playing down. While the western media gives a pro-western view of the situation in Syria, RT is giving what I feel is a more balanced view.

Sometimes I watch CBC (Canadian Broadcasting Corporation) news. I find them entirely western-centric and neo-liberal in their views, but they are far from left-leaning as some people might claim.

I rarely see Al Jazeera. I find them a souped up (or down?) version of BBC news.

Well, Fox might have high ratings, but I do not necessarily agree with their right-wing slant. That is just me, because I am a left winger. Those who agree with Fox will naturally defend their reporting.

(V): you've become boring again

Übergeek 바둑이: Interesting isn't it that FNC is the most popular cable news outlet but it, as you say, slants left. That ought to speak volumes to you leftys but you ignore the obvious. Could it possibly be that Fox presents a fair and balanced view of issues. Even Hannity has regular liberal contributors. O'Reilly has them on every day and they rarely agree with him. You don't get the diversity of opinion on the other broadcasts. People watch Fox because they trust it. Sad for you that you have to resort to a dishonest appraisal of Fox so that your ideology can be pampered.

Bernice: Yes.. it doesn't collect moss. It's also at that size very hard to stop. One can re use phrases. Such as our politicians who went through a big phase of saying "real".

btw.. don't you check figures before using them? Seeing as you represented them as being meaningful and good.

Artful Dodger: PBS is more trusted.

"As of January 2011, the Democratic Party-affiliated Public Policy Polling reports that Fox News Channel is the second-most trusted television news network in the country, with 42% of respondents reporting they trust the network, compared to other major news channels (behind PBS which stands at 50%, and ahead of NBC at 41%, CNN at 40%, CBS at 36%, and ABC at 35%). Simultaneously, Fox News Channel is also ranked the most distrusted news channel in the country, with 46% of respondents reporting they distrust the network (behind PBS at 30%, NBC at 41%, and CNN, CBS, and ABC each at 43%)."

"A leaked memo from Fox News vice president Bill Sammon to the News staff during the height of the debate over Health care reform in the United States has been cited as an example of the pro-Republican party bias of Fox News. His memo asked the staff to "use the term ‘government-run health insurance,’ or, when brevity is a concern, ‘government option,’ whenever possible." This memo was sent shortly after Republican pollster Frank Luntz advised Sean Hannity on his Fox show that: "If you call it a public option, the American people are split," he explained. "If you call it the government option, the public is overwhelmingly against it."[54]"

Bernice: So the figures are usless and meaningless?

What was the point of putting them in an album and posting them then?

I know I C&P.. everyone does here. Art mainly

Übergeek 바둑이: We've got 13 news channels available, plus a few specialist (business/parliament) ...

Good to have a range.

The reporting on Fox is based upon brash headline style graphics and slogans. The same he used to help influence peoples opinions in the UK to get them to support whoever sucked upto him the most come election time.

Fox objecting to Obama using scripture in Tax cuts push.

.. Will they complain about Republicans using the Bible to validate their anti gay/pro life stances?

Bernice: Hey.. I'm not the one who posts twisted figures!!

(V): PBS is the last news service in America that is not sucking up to big money. Their ratings skyrocketed when Bill Moyers came back out of retirement. He gives good honest commentary.

Republicans in America are known for their religious bigotry using religion to support their phony agenda.

Jack: I know... That's why I found it rather hypocritical.

(V): Facts are stubborn things. But if you like straws please, continue to grasp.

(V): Such as? Oh yeah that's right, you don't provide evidence for your claims. You just say it as if it's really true.

Artful Dodger:

> Sad for you that you have to resort to a dishonest appraisal of Fox so that your ideology can be pampered.

Like I said, Fox is not a bad network. I just don't find their style of reporting appealing to me.

Well, I find that no news channel is balanced. I said that I find it better to see several channels rather than limit myself to one.

As for my ideology, for it to be pampered I would revamp every channel. I would kill all advertising to begin with. Then I would set reporters to truly ionvestigate what politicians are doing and uncover the veil of secrecy that politicians use as a way to "protect the public and national security". I doubt that politicians want transparency or honesty. They want to carry on as always, favoring the wealthy and powerful and using the masses as mere tools to secure their power. No channel would ever report like that.

Artful Dodger: The evidence is clear.. just watch some Fox. Just like Fox paying networks to take up the broadcasting of their show is clear.. the accounts tell the story, being that they have to be published.


"Facts are stubborn things. But if you like straws please, continue to grasp. "

That Fox is the most distrusted channel... along with the surveys that show Fox news causes people to become more ignorant about the world.

.. or is that just religious led conservatism?

V the American public is the most uninformed people on the planet when it comes to politics. People look to the corporate media for information on politicians  that is readily available to them through their political history support and votes they take. The politically correct are always ready to cover up the digressions of their favored party. It's the straw man creations created by the hate mongers that give American politics a bad name. The constant bickering in support for corrupt corporations and fascism that is over taking the government. The support for corporate war where no threat exists.

Obama is not a good leader but is much better than what the republicans have put up to run against him. The hate mongers can't stand it because the president has a good solid family life and pays his taxes instead of off shoring his money to hide it. McConnell said in a public speech the only goal the republicans have is to get rid of Obama and republican politically correct think this is good leadership.

If American voters become any more uninformed about what they are supporting we won't have to bother about any recovery because their will not be anything left to recover.

(V): The problem is, you have your "facts" wrong. And rantings are not evidence. Most people know the difference.

(V): I knew you couldn't provide examples. You have none.

Jack: Ideally it would be nice if there was a cap on donations. Something they are looking into doing here in the UK to a degree. The idea that someone can and will spend $15 million on the campaigning in a single state is nuts!!

"McConnell said in a public speech the only goal the republicans have is to get rid of Obama and republican politically correct think this is good leadership."

It's crap. Yet the gravy train of lobbyist paid lunches, cars and jobs for life after office is one great big tank of swill for those who feed indiscriminately.

Artful Dodger:

From the beginning, FNC has placed heavy emphasis on visual presentation. Graphics were designed to be colorful and attention grabbing and to allow people to get the main points of what was being said even if they could not hear the host, through the use of on-screen text summarizing the position of the interviewer or speaker and "bullet points" when a host was giving commentary.

Fox News also created the "Fox News Alert," which interrupted regular programming when a breaking news story occurred.

To accelerate its adoption by cable companies, Fox News paid systems up to $11 per subscriber to distribute the channel.[16] This contrasted with the normal practice, in which cable operators paid stations carriage fees for the programming of channels.


...and again just watch the channel.

(V): so what???

Artful Dodger: It's old school tabloid.

(V): Wrong. I see none of that. It's all new school. You just make this stuff up as you go. You're like the losing team who stays on the field even though the game is long over.

(V): BTW, where did you get that info as you didn't use quotes and didn't reference a source. Are you trying to claim those are your own words?

Artful Dodger: Nope. If you look back at the history of the now sacrificial lamb "News of The World" you'll find that much the same dating back 160 years.

Such like "the Sun", "the Daily Mail" have been doing similar for decades.

The info is from wikipedia.. duhhhhh