"They focus on these three reasons but rarely address such casual reasons as the woman simply doesn't want to look fat."

I would think that statistical figure is low.. as is the use of such low level statistics.

Iamon lyme: BTW, this is not an American based site

Some of the liberal arguments supporting abortion cross over deep into stupidville.

Sex education is taught as standard at UK schools.

Artful Dodger: You still didn't answer if you are for or against abortions in these cases,I answered yours

Scientific thresholds -  survival chart of a developing fetus.

In COLOUR I'm afraid, not black and white... even some grey.

(V): And they wonder why such levels of maturity and insite has cost them the womens vote

The Col: Women should be at home ideology!!

The Col: Decency is a universal concept. So when it comes to justifying acting indecently you fall back on legality?

Seriously? That's your MO?

The Col: "...levels of maturity and insite..."

lol .. I rest my case.

"universal concept" On one planet???

I'd like to see affidavits from all other lifeforms on that.

Ok, I'll settle for those in the visible universe.

Artful Dodger: "Some of the liberal arguments supporting abortion cross over deep into stupidville."

HA, you are wrong!! Gotcha! Can you cite even ONE example of a liberal argument that doesn't? I didn't think so!


it's about time I disagreed with you on something... but I knew if I waited long enough, you'd trip up.

I see all this debate on social issues as a distraction. I know on some level, that it IS important. But in the U.S. right now the CRUCIAL issue is the economy. The Libs are LOVING distractions such as this. Because the areas where we can definitely say the Anointed One has failed, is on the economy.
If we get 4 more years of his incompetence, (and the fools in Congress who support him) we will be in big trouble. Worse trouble than The Great Depression. We will be in the same if not worse shape than parts of Europe are in right now.

I can't wait for November. I look SO forward to voting. Only once though. Silly Libs. Only once.

The Col: No, I asked: 23. August 2012, 14:44:45
[Artful Dodger,
The Col: When is it ok to kill a baby in the womb?

You answered with a question:
[The Col
Artful Dodger: Ending a pregnancy brought about by rape and incest is a good idea, no?
Reply (box)

rod03801: The libs are tripping all over themselves trying to capitalize on Akin's recent comments.

Iamon lyme: Dang it! I shouldn't have said "some." !!!

Libs, finish this sentence:

It's ok (morally justified) to kill a baby in the womb when...............

Artful Dodger: I think anyone who engages in it right now, is feeding into it though. I say switch it back to the RIGHT conversation. To what is important NOW. The whole abortion debate will be FOREVER. The economy is something that needs fixing NOW.

Ok, I'm being silly. This is just a discussion board on a game site.. LOL.. I think I'm frustrated because it is mirroring what is going on.

rod03801: We're just being current. Ha! You should have seen Twitter over the last two days. Funny stuff and it was a hot time in the Twitter Town last night!

Artful Dodger: I'm weird. I'm not part of any of the social networks. I have an account on facebook that I never visit.

I've thought about joining Twitter, to be part of Sean Hannity's following. He's my hero!

rod03801: haha I follow him on Twitter. I listen to his radio show when I can

Artful Dodger: I listen to the last hour of it on my way home from work. He is the one conservative talk dude that makes sense to me. I watch him on tv rarely, only because I have other shows I like at the same time he is on. He is FAIR and smart. Bugged me that he wouldnt say he was voting for in the primaries. LOL.

rod03801: "Bugged me that he wouldnt say [who] he was voting for in the primaries."

None of the other conservative talk show hosts would say either. In fact most of them said it's not their place to tell anyone who they should vote for, and rightly so.

I just had a funny thought. A liberal would probably say this is a part of the right wing's strategy, to get voters to believe it's actually up to them to elect our leaders. Which means it's up to them to decide who the leader will be. What a novel idea... instead of telling the voter what to do, leave it up to the voter to decide. Naaa, that can't be right... it's a right wing trick to get liberal voters to do the same. Those right wing extremists will try anything to steal this next election. LOL And you know what, it just might work. But maybe it's not too late for the liberals to counter this devious scheme by doing the same thing. Yeah, yeah... TWO can play at that game!

rod03801: I wish I had his hair.

And still no Conservative from the US can answer one question.

What gives them the right to dictate to women what to do with their bodies. What gives them the right to dictate to couples what to do with their life.

What gives them the right to use a religious tool to say you should do this?

No answer from Dan or Lamon lyme.

Typical!!

So Rupert Murdoch thinks it's vital that naked pics of a Prince are printed on the front page of "The Sun"...

Isn't there a moral issue involved?

Before 1980, the Southern Baptist Convention officially advocated for loosening of abortion restrictions.[16] During the 1971 and 1974 Southern Baptist Conventions, Southern Baptists were called upon "to work for legislation that will allow the possibility of abortion under such conditions as rape, incest, clear evidence of severe fetal deformity, and carefully ascertained evidence of the likelihood of damage to the emotional, mental, and physical health of the mother."[16] W. Barry Garrett wrote in the Baptist Press, "Religious liberty, human equality and justice are advanced by the [Roe v. Wade] Supreme Court Decision."[16]

By 1980, conservative Protestant leaders became vocal in their opposition to legalized abortion,[17] and by the early 1990s Pat Robertson's Christian Coalition of America became a significant pro-life organization.[11] In 2005, Richard Land, president of the Southern Baptist Convention’s Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission, said that making abortion illegal is more important than any other issue.[18]

>>> So Conservative Christians... why the policy change?

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints takes a position against abortion and holds that abortion is a form of killing. However, there are exceptions. According to a statement in the LDS library, "Some exceptional circumstances may justify an abortion, such as when pregnancy is the result of incest or rape, when the life or health of the mother is judged by competent medical authority to be in serious jeopardy, or when the fetus is known by competent medical authority to have severe defects that will not allow the baby to survive beyond birth." The statement goes on to say, "Those who face such circumstances should consider abortion only after consulting with their local Church leaders and receiving a confirmation through earnest prayer."[25]

(V): "No answer from Dan or Lamon lyme."

You didn't ask me, but since you obviously want my opinion...

My opinion is you only want an excuse to continue ragging on and on about religion. And since my answer would not involve religion, I cannot satisfy that desire. But if you could drop the inquisition mentality long enough to focus on the "It's a womans body" argument, I do have an answer for that.

First of all, I am not a woman. But I have cared for infants who are too helpless to help themselves. Tell me V, how many newborns do you think are not helpless, and able to survive without anyones help?

If I'm going about my business and grow weary of caring for one of these helpless little people, then I could use the same argument for leaving the little gubber by the side of the road to fend for itself. It's my body, and who has the right to tell me what to do with my body? My body is selfish and lazy, and tired of hauling this little crying and pooping bundle of joy everywhere I go.

The difference between a baby in the womb and a baby in my arms is apparently so vast, that it's probably incomprehensible for you to grasp the significance of "helplessness". So maybe you should try figuring this one out for yourself.

Or, you might try to find a pregnant woman who knows the difference between her own body and the body of the person she is carrying. But don't try telling her it's okay for her to kill that person, or she might bonk you on the head with her purse. Don't be that man... you know, the kind of man that lumps all women together and thinks he can say the exact same thing to any woman he crosses paths with.

Iamon lyme: Jules asked me a question? Could have fooled me. I've been skipping over his babble. What's he asking? About Mormonism and Romney?

Artful Dodger: "What's he asking? About Mormonism and Romney?"

lol I must have skipped over the Mormonism and Romney rants... I didn't read any of those.

Iamon lyme: Wow... a straight forward reply seems to be out of the question for you.

(V): You were the one who asked. If you don't like the answer, then ask someone who gives you an answer you do like.

I will tell you what I think, but I'm not here to tell you only what you want to hear. Talking to you has been like talking to one of those pre-progammed question/answer machines.

So tell me V, how do you figure ignoring my answer can in any way support your thesis? How does that work?

Iamon lyme: The answer seems to be you have no respect for the woman. You only consider her a baby machine. Most of the rest was just mumbo jumbo made up bull.

I do like answers, just I like them from people who will answer straight rather than play spin games.

Iamon lyme: I know all about Mormonism. The Mormons quit coming to my door. I always give them a hard time I guess. The last time they came to my door one of the Mormons swore at me. Then he told me I was pissing him off. I reminded him that he came to MY door uninvited and that he needed to remember that. I wasn't even being mean. I was just pointing out some of the inconsistencies in their claims.

(V): LOL Well, seeing as how I think with my brain, then I guess there is no point in... oh man, you really are a piece of work. LOL

By the way, when did you stop being "your mothers body" and start being something else... or are you still waiting for that to happen. LOL

The Col: Nobody who is anybody actually watches MSNBC. Or as Levin says, MSLSD. They are a joke. Their ratings prove it.

Artful Dodger: I remember Jehovahs Witnesses coming to my door, but not any Mormons. There are Mormons where I live, but I don't think they do a lot of door to door visits unless it's with someone they already know... meaning, other Mormons.

Iamon lyme: Jules is clueless on the abortion debate. Don't waste your time.

Iamon lyme: It's a term.. You do understand metaphors and the like?

I was 'carried' for about nine months. Until I was born I relied on a (this is science) a parasitic lifestyle (just as you and everyone else does) where my embryo released a hormone to stop my host's immune system killing me.

I thank the woman for carrying me, and out of respect for her I'd never force her or any other woman by law to be automatic baby carriers.

I guess I have respect for life that is first and not a life that maybe and cannot be for several months on it's own.

Iamon lyme: The JWs just leave comic books to read and never want to talk much. But they hardly ever come by. The Mormons are out on their little missions and come to my town from all over the US. They are just doing their little mission thing that's required of them and they all say the same thing to start with. They are dressed in suits and cute little backpacks and want to know if there's some work they can help with. I needed some rock moved so I pointed to the pile and they said they'd be back the next day. Never heard from them again. But a year later two different dudes show up.

(V): Okay, then I'll rephrase the question. When did your parasitic lifestyle end and... oh forget it.

It's obvious when an answer is too much for you. You either spam the board until it leaves the page, or you start fights that end in a moderator deleting it for you. I have news for you, the moderators won't automatically delete the parts only YOU find offensive. Grow up.

Iamon lyme: You don't like my answer and are moaning.

Tuff.

Iamon lyme: He's just regurgitating the abortion rights talking points. Tells you what he thinks of children in the womb.

Artful Dodger: I always accept the comic books, except for the one time I was expected to pay a quarter for it. I don't think that was supposed to be part of the routine, I think the young lady just didn't like the idea of the cost coming out of her own pocket. It was funny, she didn't mention the quarter until I reached out to take the offered comic book, so there we were both holding onto it. But I did think about it for a few seconds before letting go of the book. LOL

... tells you what Conservative Christians think of women...

Is it the Mary Magdalene bit, Eve (Lilith being too much for Adam to handle), man being master of his house...

God is not male you know, the man being master refers to metaphors on assertiveness. Female being the passive assertive and man being the aggressive assertive.

Iamon lyme: lol

I like to ask the Mormons, "Why are you here." Then when they give me an answer I challenge it. They tell me they are here to offer help if I need something done and to share "another testament of Jesus Christ." But I ask them where they are from and I get "California" or "Georgia" So I explain that they are NOT here to see if I need help, they are here to fulfill their obligations to their church and they are using me to do it. I explain that they are not even from here and have no personal interest in me except for how visiting my home helps them fulfill their missionary requirements. And, I say, you are here to tell me my views are wrong and yours are right.

It just goes downhill from there.

Artful Dodger: LOL You have less patience that I do. I endure the pitch for as long as I can, and then I tell them. You're right though, it's all down hill after that.

It's probably better your way. I just make it worse by leading them to think I don't know anything before dropping the hammer. For me it's all about time and interest... do I have the time to deal with this, and do I feel at all interested in going through with this again? LOL