The Usurper:Good analogy.  Johnson was a horrible President.  He is responsible for the deaths of thousands of young men in the armed services.  He knew we couldn't win, wouldn't win, and he escalated the war anyway.  Then he lied to the troops about our war effort and winning possibilities.  He was only trying to save face.  What an ass.

Artful Dodger: Ok, some consistency begins to emerge. Thank you. Let's look at Vietnam, for example. Nixon is rightly blamed for not ending it quickly enough. But Johnson, the corrupt Democrat, is the one who escalated it to full-scale war to begin with. Guilt spreads across the board, for many issues. Thus, my contention that we're watching Good Cop/Bad Cop smoke screens to keep us entertained while the guy in the shadows steals the loot.

The Usurper:I keep telling you it's the cows.  And no, O'Reilly doesn't blame the small guy.  He puts the blame where it belongs.  When corporations pollute, he's on them like....can't say that in here but it flies and is attracted to brown stuff. 

The Usurper:I expect stupidity from the democrats and they never disappoint.  But you're right.  The Republicans have dished out plenty of stupidity too.  Case in point is the rush to bail out the banks.  All idiots.  Let the banks fail.  My bank has lots of money cuz they didn't lend to people that had no ability to pay!  My home is paid off!  Not everyone was being stupid.  Bush lost my respect in his final years and the bank bailout was the final straw.  What a bunch of morons.  Billions gone and no one can account for much of it.  The economy is worse, and they are asking for yet more money.  Let them all fail!  Give money to the banks that are succeeding!  They know how to manage money!

Artful Dodger: Big business IS responsible for most of the pollution, the stripping of the earth, etc. I understand what O'Reilly means. He blames the small guy. What is new?

The Usurper:
  It's like my hero Bill O'Reilly says.  Even if global warming isn't caused by humans, don't be pinheads.  Keep the earth clean.  Don't pollute.  Be responsible.  You gotta love that kind of thinking.  Why add to the problems of pollution?  Bill says clean it up and do all you can to keep the earth healthy.  Good advice.  But the environmentalists won't have any of that.  They want to punnish big business even if they aren't responsible for any polution.  Robert Kennedy jr is the worst.  He's a radical nut if ever there was one.  He's truly wacked.  I think he smoked too much pot in his college days and is still on a high. 

Artful Dodger: Ok, here's a shot at a jumpstart. Say it with me....not only Democrats but also REPUBLICANS have gotten us into this mess! There, you can say it. And let's take it a step further...not only Democrats but also REPUBLICANS are endangering our freedoms, violating the Constitution, and generally interests alien to the common citizen. There, you can say it! Kick that door down.

The Usurper:If we killed all the cows of the world, we could all drive huge SUVs!  And Gore could keep his jets and huge house.  But then he'd be out of a job as propaganda minister for the environmentalists so it's best we breed the cows, eat them, and continue to let them fart us all out of existence.  However there is good news, science will likely harnass cow farts into a usable energy source. 

Artful Dodger: Those are interesting links & I'll admit there's some question about the whole thing, and some merit to the counter-position. One small complaint I have.....the font isn't big enough so it's hard for me to click on them. lol

The Usurper: hahahaha............

The Usurper:Let me help you kick it in 

Bernice: I love it when AD is right, too. That's why I have so much love stored up, just waiting...... ;o)

Bernice:  I have a puppet named Bosley Bunny and he's always getting in trouble for the things he says.  He's been banned in the library for a while.  It's funny, but AD is a lot like that little Bosley puppet and for some reason, I feel his presence tonight. 

Artful Dodger: "I just start with the obvious one: democrats, and go from there."

I'm still waiting for the last phrase in your statement to kick in. :o)

The Usurper:I've always recognized that someone had to be blamed.  I just start with the obvious one:  democrats, and go from there. 

Are the scientists and economists who ask these questions just a
fringe group, outside the scientific mainstream? Not at all. A 2003
survey of 530 climate scientists in 27 countries, conducted by Dennis
Bray and Hans von Storch at the GKSS Institute of Coastal Research in
Germany, found

• 82 percent said global warming is happening, but only

• 56 percent said it’s mostly the result of human causes, and only

• 35 percent said models can accurately predict future climate conditions.

http://www.heartland.org/NewYork08/newyork08.html

Hardly consensus. 


I tell ya, it's cow farts! 

"there
has been no net global warming since 1998.

"significant
new peer-reviewed research has cast even more doubt on the hypothesis
of dangerous human-caused global warming."

Although some
blame global warming for seemingly
everything, according to others higher temperatures will increase
the amount of land that we can use to grow food, it will improve
people's health, and increase biological diversity.

I love being right about everything. 

Artful Dodger: If you recognize someone OUGHT to be blamed, that's a step forward. :o)

Artful Dodger: If you want to know the truth, I think a chance at real democracy (i.e., the republic) died at his death. That was when the Military-Industrial-Complex, that Eisenhower warned us about, asserted its clandestine rule.

I blame the democrats for the war in Iraq.  

The Usurper:
  He had a nasty last name.  Crappy one if you know what I mean. 

Artful Dodger: I knew Jack. Jack was a friend of mine. Etc. lol

The Usurper: They don't know jack.  And Jack says they are full of

Artful Dodger: P.S. I love eating cow but some people have a cow over it.

Artful Dodger: lol Those 2,500 scientists don't agree with you. But what do they know? ;o)

Global Warming:  It's a cycle.  Been here before, be here again.  Humans should take care of the earth but cow farts cause more green house gasses than anything man does.  Eat a cow and save the earth. 

From National Geographic:

http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2004/12/1206_041206_global_warming.html

Artful Dodger: A Quote from your link to the study:

Swanson thinks the trend could continue for up to 30 years. But he warned that it's just a hiccup, and that humans' penchant for spewing greenhouse gases will certainly come back to haunt us.

"When the climate kicks back out of this state, we'll have explosive warming," Swanson said. "Thirty years of greenhouse gas radiative forcing will still be there and then bang, the warming will return and be very aggressive."

The Usurper:AGain, Bush has nothing to do with the question I was addressing.  It had ONLY to do with Clinton.  It's true that there was a Republican majority in Congress.  It's true that they made it very difficult, if not impossible for Clinton to go against their will.  They controlled the congress.  He had to tailor things to suit them or nothing could get done.  And it's also true that Clinton began the banking deregulation.  He convinced the republicans to go along with him, and they did.  They are at fault for this whole mess too.  But as I said, the question I was addressing had only to do with Clinton.  Bush isn't in the picture.

Artful Dodger: Trust me, I'm not defending Clinton. I know how much harm he did to the economy. But the budget was balanced during his administration...and without his cooperation, it couldn't have happened. If you prefer to think the Republican Congress muscled him, that's your prerogative. Again, I refer you to history. They didn't likewise "muscle" Bush. And Bush is as much a part of the point as is Clinton, and Reagan, etc. Narrow political boundaries hardly begin to address our predicament.

ScarletRose: I think she's already gone through it. Something about being gone with the wind...lol But one can sip margaritas and discuss politics! Indeed, it is often required.

Tues.. where is that door?? Please.. where there is no man.. where a female can sit and sip margaritas in peace.. without politics and major mind stuff?? LOL

The Usurper: Bush is not the point.  Historical facts are historical facts.  Clinton was kept in check by the Republican congress.  Period.  And Clinton lifted the lid on the banks.  He's the one that opened the pandora's box and it began with him.  Others are responsible too but he began the whole mess. It's history.  It's clearly a fact and can't be disputed.  Bush has nothing to do with the point.  1999.  Bush wasn't president then. 

"Thinking people sometimes have intellectually honest differences of opinion, and often examine themselves critically. Unthinking people have no intellectual honesty and precious little self-insight."

Artful Dodger: Funny, they had no problem letting Bush spend it. And our economy is in far worse shape now than it was under Carter. Can Obama make it better? Very doubtful, because he won't address the core issues. Fiscal Conservatives should be impressed neither with Obama nor Bush nor Reagan, nor Nixon, nor Johnson, etc. I don't see how anyone can believe we are represented by either party, whether in Congress or in the Oval Office.

The Usurper:He balanced the budget because the Republicans controlled congress.  They wouldn't let him spend all that surplus money. 

Obama's economic plan will go the way of Carter. 

Artful Dodger: It goes back to Reagan, who first set the record for government debt, before Bush Jr. broke his record.

But it really goes further than that...to Nixon, who removed the gold standard. Then back further, to Wilson, who signed the Federal Reserve into law.

Roosevelt tooks steps to help the economy. Clinton hurt the economy in the long run with Nafta, but nevertheless he balanced the budget, and provided a surplus...used up by Bush (and more!) to fund an illegal war.

The Usurper:It goes back to Clinton.

Artful Dodger: You can thank Bush, his illegal war & his oil-sipping buddies, not to mention Wall Street high-rollers...for that.

Artful Dodger: Earth to AD...the America you know no longer exists. It hasn't for some time. I can see that nothing I've said for the past 3 weeks has made a dent. lol Seriously, Americans in general need a new perspective, in my opinion. I'm afraid we're all headed down, down, down...with little hope of escaping from the Matrix (in the short run).

As to Obama's stimulus package, it doesn't seriously address this country's economic problems, I agree, but I'm not sure anything can short of an entire restructuring of how we do business (repealing NAFTA, stopping outsourcing & forcing companies to manufacture in America, reestablishing unions, etc.) And...in spite of its weaknesses, Obama's plan WILL help some people who NEED it! That means it is both more efficient & more ethical than Bush's bailout.

Tuesday: I should say you are in Heaven.. which door did you take??

Think about it... we could really be in Hell.. and yet when we die.. we are actually going back to a place where we are given another chance at Heaven... hmmmm!!