Artful Dodger: I respect our difference of opinions on this,but I AM glad to see that you help by recycling and help take care of the environment...I can't ask,nor would I ever ask any of you to change your opionins,THAT is what makes debates fun after all,right,but I am glad that you seem not to take things on this planet for granted

Universal Eyes: We should follow the example of the Native Americans...they respect the earth as a being and SHOW her the respect she deserves.
And good point to bring up about taking a tree,planting a tree...tress do after all,help provide us with oxygen...you cut down to many,and never replace them,because as you point out,WHERE would you plant them? We are taking all the land to build stuff on...so less trees,less "filtering" the trees can do...It goes back to my example of the exaust fan in the room.

Vikings: IMO it is absolute arrogance to think that man can cause global warming

And in MY opinion...it is absolute ignorance to think that we play no part in it

Artful Dodger: Sorry, but the fact that CFC's were destroying the Ozone layer is a fact. There is no point in you disputing this as the chemical reactions of CFC's on ozone is well established. That's why if you (well in the UK anyway) dump your old fridge it has to be done via a special unit (rather then just putting it on a dump) to recover and dispose of the gasses in the cooling system safely.

Nirvana: wow,I just watched that,unreal!! Thank you for finding that for me :)

(V): you have to dipose of them that way in the staes too...Before my Dad died,he was a heating/cooling/general contractor and I remember when he had to go to school to learn how to reclaim the freeon (sp,sorry) and he had to buy a reclaimer also,which was a VERY shiney penney or 2,lol.But yeah,you have to be a licensed tech to do that.

Vikings: Um actually the scientists from what I've seen will debate the evidence behind Global warming.... And as for Greenland.. Isn't it true that ice sheets around it are disintegrating?

And as a statement of how we can affect the planet... 14 years after the accident at Chernobyl sheep in Wales still had to be checked to see what their radiation levels were and if they were safe to sell for meat.

anastasia: Similar problems are happening in India, where men, women and kids are taking computers apart for the valuable elements with no protection against the dangerous chemicals needed to do the job or those produced from recycling them. Something that would be banned full stop from happening in the 'west'.

anastasia: I remember when all the aerosols containing cfc's were banned. It wasn't a long debate... They banned them.

This is so true! I mean, are we supposed to believe that..... if Gore did not get ripped off from becoming president he never would have figured out that we only had 3 years left to save the planet from irreversible climate change? (that was 2 years ago)

Whew! How close was that one then? Everybody complaining that he really won the presidency, but if he had, the world would be lost forever!

(V): I dont think anybody is arguing that man does not have an effect on the planet!

Its just are we really 1 year away from irreversible and catastrophic problems if we dont ruin our economy even more by adopting the Kyoto protocol?

Czuch: I would say no,lol...BUT if we don't change things NOW,then what??

(V): I also remember when they were banned...my Dad was glad of it too

Czuch: Over here they show the Gore film at schools, but they also state that it's not that accurate in certain details.

That's why I read and listen to the scientific community who are the ones advising our governments on what's going on.

anastasia: Do you really think that man can reverse the climate changes? How would that be possible? Earth will do what he wants to do and nothing will stop him...

Pedro Martínez: her...Earth is always referred to in the feminan manner ;)
I think man can stop the climate changes from going any further by reducing polution and other greenhouse gasses into the air.....plant more trees,preserve what we have

anastasia: Yes, I've noticed. Earth is always referred to in the feminine manner...by you.

So if we said OK, now we'll move back to caves, stop using all the "pollutants", etc etc, it would stop the sea level from rising, it would stop the glaciers from melting? I have to apologize to you for what I am now going to say, but that's just an unbelievable ignorance of the entire history of our planet, it's just so ridiculous. You know what's the biggest threat to Earth? People like you.

AL Gore is a phony blowhard and has been his whole life as a spoiled rich kid, just as bad or worse than bush.. as in he latched onto global warming, but he jetsets to Aspen with the best of them like maddonna and the other hollywood types, brad pitt , jolie, streisand, of course these royalty are ever so more important

Pedro Martínez: I never said move back to caves and stop using pollutants altho cutting back on polutats would be bad...why???...I did however say,if we cut a tree,plant a tree,preserve what we have...No need to aploigize for your opinion,however why I am I the threat? Because I want to make this planet a better place? To not pollute it so much??..hang me up,I want to plant a tree and save an owl..OMG run for the hills!! Hide your kids!!!

Charles Martel: I wonder about that myself...you say global warming,stop this,stop that..and then get into a jet and fly to all your speaking engagements...weird stuff,ehh?

Pedro Martínez: Most creation stories refer to the Earth as being feminine. For eg the Maori creation story refers to the sky being Father and the Earth being Mother.

In Judaism the Adam is formed out of the Adamah "אדםה" which is the female form of ground. And as far as I've always been taught, it is right and only proper to refer to Earth as "Mother Earth"

And no, maybe stopping the pollutants may not stop natural variations in the Earth's weather... But It'll reduce our impact.

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

Artful Dodger: I agree with everything you say :)
I'm not down on you guys that don't think global warming is real,honestly I'm not...I think this is a really awesome debate we have going,and for the most part,been very friendly and both sides of the issue is getting out there!!
Glad to hear that you recycle anf are doing your part to help things out!!!

wow! what the heck happened there,LMAO!!! I guess I REALLY REALLY agree,huh!!

Scientists Test Artificial Upwelling

I saw a fascinating (to me anyway) show on Planet Green channel about a team of scientist that are testing ways to increase plankton in barren areas of the ocean.  They think this would help with decreasing levels of CO² and slow down the Greenhouse effect.

The link is to an article about the work.

One thing I thought was really cool was while the test was not a complete sucess (the tubes were ripped to shreds by the currents), one pump worked for about 56 hours.  and within 12 days after that, a lot of marine life showed up in the area.  Before the placement, there was no marine life at all there.

He's been a bad bad boy,and I'm not speaking of the use of aerosol deodorant.

Jim Dandy: Well first he took the money from our local state park which was scheduled to close at the end of November - and after a lot of people calling daily, our local park is one of the few that got the money back to stay open.

Of course I also work at a non-profit agency in his state, and his cut backs on money we normally get from the state has hurt.

Oh, I don't like him very much.........

coan.net: He's in alot of trouble,did you not hear of his arrest today?

http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/12/09/blagojevich.affidavit/?iref=mpstoryview

Jim Dandy: yes I did - kind of "happy" news here where I work....... even though I don't like the idea of spending more money on a special election to pick Obama's replacement because of costs when there is already not enough money to go around.... but I don't like the idea of the governor picking either......

coan.net: You might as well just put the Sham Wow guy in office.I don't think my cynicism can get any lower.

Eriisa: That was a really interesting article!! Thanks for posting it!

anastasia: I think man can stop the climate changes from going any further by reducing polution and other greenhouse gasses into the air.....plant more trees,preserve what we have


Before man and our pollution and our greenhouse gases, what cause the climate to change back then?

Pedro Martínez: So if we said OK, now we'll move back to caves, stop using all the "pollutants", etc etc, it would stop the sea level from rising, it would stop the glaciers from melting? I have to apologize to you for what I am now going to say, but that's just an unbelievable ignorance of the entire history of our planet, it's just so ridiculous. You know what's the biggest threat to Earth? People like you.


Did somebody give you a lobotomy while you were gone?

coan.net: but I don't like the idea of the governor picking either

Yeah, whats up with that anyway? What if the governor is from a different party? I think the senate can refuse to let the nominee in anyway, but then does the governor pick someone else? How does it work? I see that in NY they are gonna give Hillaries spot to Kennedy, girl, just because her name is Kennedy? She has never been in any political position her whole life?

Anyway, seems like weird deal, but was probably always like this, just never noticed before.

Jim Dandy: He's in alot of trouble,did you not hear of his arrest today?


LOL, sounds like politics as usual to me, isnt everything for sale in some fashion or another?

Czuch: Did somebody give you a lobotomy while you were gone?

Hmmm, I guess so, as I don't have a clue what you're getting at.

Czuch: lordy...have you read nothing I posted?? I agree,earth has always gone through the heating/cooling cyles...I AGREE.....what I said was that we are adding more then the earth can process right now.

Pedro Martínez: My bad memory I guess... seems to me you used to be one of the biggest supporters of the Kyoto Protocol and a huge proponent of 'global warming'?

anastasia: Sorry, I kind of respond to them as I read them, there were 25 unread when I got here... I thought I remember a few days back on gen chat you were surprised that I didnt agree with the global warming crowd? Anyway, from what I read lately you seem to have moderated more on the topic, and although you are for environmental protection, you arent out there saying we need to ruin economies to keep the glaciers from melting and the sea from flooding NY.

Czuch: I do believe in global warming...I do know that the earht goes through it's natural cycles....I'm REALLY ok with people having different opinions as I do...I amvery glad to hear that even tho alot of you don;t agree there is a global warming problem you still recylce,and try to reduce what you throw away...and I know about all the posts,I added this one to my favorites list so that I never get to far behind on the posts,lol!!!

Czuch: I believe I had actually never commented on this issue here. Simply because I didn't have enough information back then. People are being "massaged" by the environmentalist propaganda and it seems to me as if it has become some new sort of religion, at least here in Europe. Governments keep adopting new and new "green" laws just because it's popular and even if they see and know it's just not right to limit people's freedoms only for the sake of some unfounded catastrophic theory, they do not dare to oppose the prevalent opinion. I'm already sick of this. I'm not free to use the bulbs I want (because they're not "environment-friendly"), I have to pay more for diesel fuel (because it's not "environment-friendly"), my taxes are higher because the government needs more money to fight the global warming, etc etc. Where's the reason? Can you imagine the laugh, the blast, people will have in some 200 years from now, looking back at what we're doing right now?

Pedro Martínez: maybe they will say...working with the knowledge that the people had then (meaning US right now) they tried doing what they thought was right.
You guys HAVE to use certain light bulbs?? I am not 100% sold on the new ones here,sure they save energy and help reduce energy costs to the people using them...BUT what alot of people don't know,I never knew till the news report is that if one breaks,say in my kitchen I drop it,I have to have speacial haz mat stuff to clean it (I'm sure EVERYONE has some of that in the pantries,right?)
because the lights contain mercury and everyone knows what murcuery does

anastasia: Well get used to it as it is already a law that all light bulbs here have to be those energy savings bulbs by I believe 2011. oh and you cant throw the new bulbs away either away

Pedro Martínez: I believe I had actually never commented on this issue here.

I know I am losing my mind now... I would have sworn... must have been Gogul, or Andre or someone like that who told me what an idiot I was for not supporting it (the kyoto)

anyway, I have debated with so many for so long on so many topics, no wonder I confuse myself!

Oh yeah, you supported invading Iraq too right?

Vikings: we already have some here in the house..I do like the light they give,but really...how DO you get rid of them when the burn out?? recycle I would assume...but if they recyle them the way they are recycling on that story Nirvana posted then it is kind of a moot point....(I have been waiting to use that word,hehe..lil things make me happy :)

Jim Dandy: ROFLOLOLOL @ Sham Wow.

I think the Sham Wow guy would be more than happy to be Governor. and I used to think Billy Mays was annoying......

Eriisa: aww,ya don't like Vince..I mean"come on,we can't do this all day" lol

Just curious how many throw old meds down the toilet? Stop and think what it does to your drinking water.

Foxy Lady: my sister in law use to dump her old paint down the sewers...OMG!
any clue on how to dispose of old meds???