Artful Dodger: yes but he is a just a christian right wing self made multimillionaire, so I am sure that those numbers are just spin




there now no else can try that approach

Vikings: The fact that the government can spend more that it has and keep going is not spin. It's the reason some people want government work, because they can make more than they can in a comprable private secter job, along with having more job security. A public secter job can only go belly up if the tax revenue for that particular job dries up, or if the private secter itself is damaged to the point where it can no longer provide tax revenue for any government job.. hopefully we can pull back before it reaches that point, but it is that point which is precisely what we are being warned about. We are not being warned about not being able to support someones pet project, we are being warned about a complete system wide shutdown. Killing the goose that lays all of them golden eggs won't get ya anymore of them eggs.. know what I mean?

The problem as I see it is not that there is no solution, the problem seems to be that people have been fooled into believing it can't be corrected because of the scale of the problem. What works on a small scale will work on a larger scale. It's worked before, so why all the confusion over what needs to be done?

Iamon lyme: Or, I suppose I could've just said "good principles work!"

Iamon lyme:

What's interesting is the government's explanation that by spending more money and then putting that money back into the economy, the economy is stimulated and people then spend, hire, invest, etc. When that happens, more taxes are generated and the government makes back it's initial investment and then some!

But then why are we so far it debt as a nation?

Because Keynesian economics doesn't work. Now why can't those pinheads in Washington figure that out?

Artful Dodger: You are starting from the wrong assumption. Logically, their primary target is to get reelected. That's how the game rules are written, and that's how they play it.
Any other 'targets' (general happyness, full employment, world control, whatever) are secondary, and are at best collateral.

Aganju: Yes, you are correct. And I don't see anything in Washington changing unless people start demanding and pressuring their reps. Those pinheads live in another world.

Aganju: George Carlin sums up politicians and the myth of electing them very well.... The masters just use them as a means of population control.

Aganju: That explains the motivation for making stupid decisions. Many of them are motivated by only a desire to excercise control and to keep their jobs.

The argument here doesn't hinge on no government vs complete government control. Government control and regulation are a good thing up to a point, but beyond that point it just gums up the works and doesn't help free enterprise to do what it naturally does all by itself. As I see it the real problem is when government tries to excercise too much control by inserting itself into the market, as though their involvement will somehow help a process that works best if left alone.