I am playiing in a tournament where one section is finished, and the other section, where there is already a winner, has two games which looks like they could take another year or more to finish at the current rate. Mow I might not live that long, which will frag out the tournament another three years as everybody waits for me to movel. Is there SOME way to get a tournament moving when the players who are holding it up have ABSOLUTELY NO CHANCE OF MOVING TO THE NEXT ROUND!

Antje: wonder IF it will ever be finished. But I'm pretty sure that at this rate I'll be long gone - and holding it up even more!

Hrqls: Is THAT tournament still running? I was in that tournament and my last move was TEN years ago! How ridiculous that a simple backgammon tournament should last TEN years! With any luck you should be able to win the tournament before you die - is your health good? I actually think that for future tournaments, there should be a provision that any games not completed within 12 months of the start of the tournament round should be forfeited, and the leading player after 12 months should be promoted to the next round. Ok, I know we can't do that for running tournaments (actually we could if anybody had the inclination and initiative to take a stand and actually DO it), but maybe in future??? - if Fencer can "be bothered!"

Hrqls: It is very nice of you to reply in such a positive manner. You know why I am not a paying member, and actually I don't especially want to play in tournaments. The fact is, I CAN win this tournament, but only if I live long enought!! NINE YEARS IS A LONG TIME FOR (part of) A TOURNAMENT!

beach: Thank you for your homily. You will see from my profile that I joined this site about 2 weeks after you did, and have been playing here for a little over 12 years. During that time I have had a paid membership for about three years, and informed Fencer that I would renew my paid membership when he implemented a sensible autopass feature in BG. Sadly, his response was "can't be bothered" so hence I have declined to renew my paid membership. Before you tell me that there is an autopass feature, think about how much better it COULD be.

I am not actually fussed about winning or losing the tournament. As I said, I am 75 years old now, and if it goes on for another 5 years, I might well be dead, and then it will take another 7 years or so for me to time out before the next round can begin. In the end the winner will be the player who outlives all the others! What a great result THAT would be!! I am NOT upset, and it is not restricting me from playing and enjoying games. It just seems to me that taking NINE years to complete a Backgammon tournament, whatever the parameters, is just bloody ridiculous.

If less people are signing up for tournaments, maybe this is one of the reasons!

ThunderGr: "There is nothing anybody can do about it" - What rubbish!! There is PLENTY people could do about it if they had the will. If you had said "There is nothing we feel like doing anything about" I would have believed you.

"It is all about what most people enjoy best." - I think I am speaking for all of the people who have already qualified for the next round, and most of them several YEARS ago, that they are "most people" in your context, and I am sure that they would "enjoy best" to delete the two players who are holding things up, and get on with the tournament. The two players holding up the tournament are not "most people".
Reply

GoodFoods' 6th Broiling Backgammon Invitational (Backgammon)
It's 9 (NINE - that's NINE) YEARS (yese, not weeks or days - YEARS since the first round of this tournament and there are still two players playing THE FIRST RFOUND!!!

Match type: 13 points match with doubling cube
Tournament type (?): two games (switched colors) for each two players
Membership level:
Minimum number of players: 4
Maximum number of players: unlimited
Maximum number of players per section: 5
Final match type for two player section: 13 points match with doubling cube
Time control (?): 5 days, standard vacation
Player rating: 100 <= BKR <= 4000
Unrated players: yes
Unrated games (no BKR will be affected by this tournament): no
Private tournament (you will send personal invitations): no
Sort players by BKR: yes
Status: running
Start date and time: 18. November 2005, 14:24:18

As you can see, this tournamant started 7 years ago. It is ridiculous that some people have not even finished THE FIRST ROUND!! I'm 75 year old, and would actually like to play to the end of the tournament. But what if I die before the next round? Will all my subsequent games have to time out? What about a "first round must be finished by" date to avoid this utter stupidity.</b></b>

GoodFoods' 6th Broiling Backgammon Invitational

This is f......g ridiculous. This tournament started over six years ago and the first round id not yet over, I am not a young man, and it would be nice if it could be completed before I die, or there will be a lot of frustrated entrants waiting for me to time out long after I have!

Clandestine 1: Apparently I joined two (unfinished) tournaments (when I had Brain Rook status), and they both started more than three years ago. I think I made the last move in the Goodfoods one about three months ago. Ok, I know the rules. I am happy to buy a Brain Rook membership again when there is a sensible autopass system introduced for backgammon. If that had been the case for these stalled tournaments, maybe they would have finished already. Never mind, I can find other backgammon sites, It's just a shame that tournaments can run for five years withn no apparent progress. I can't think who actually enjoys them.

I signed up for a tournament in February 2006 (when I was a Brain Rook) and it is still running - though my section finished about two years ago - I have not made a move in this tournament for two years!

Is there some way to default and remove myself from this tournament so I can sign up for some monthly fast-paced tournaments? (I am getting older, and at the pace this tournament is running, I'm quite likely not to be alive when it ends.)

Andre Faria: I think most players will probably die of boredom

KotDB: You have expressed this most eloquently. And if it's a draw in a single game, then the best (ie the higher-ranked) player should proceed to the next round. Thankyou for your excellent contribution.

http://brainking.com/en/Tournaments?trg=12232&trnst=0 A fast cube tournament (2100+) for first 5 to sign up

BIG BAD WOLF: That seems eminently sensible for chess perhaps, but backgammon!!! Who needs more than a minute or two to make a backgammon move? If everybody took 21 days the first round could take two to three years!!

rod03801: i agree. Anybody who needs to set up a tournament which starts more than a month in advance has a serious problem. Maybe this should be moved to "Feature requests" to see if we can get some sanity to tournament setup!

Vikings: It would avoid a lot of unnecessary bickering if everybody over 1500 at the start of a 1500 and under tournament was automatically deleted.

This is a bit like police speeding fines. Do they book you for going 101 in a 100KPH area. Not usually. 102? 103? (In NZ it is almost a well known fact that you can go 110 and not get booked, but if they radar you at 111, then they throw the book at you.)

So if the removals must be done by human intervention, then accept 1599, reject 1602 would be a perfectly acceptable thing to do. You need to have a breakoff point. Hey, what about 1605, 1609, 1612? May as well make it an open tournament if the rules are so flexible!

Backoff: Oh good. Then the Hyperspace Team Tournament which I have been waiting a month to make a move in can proceed after I take MY vacation (not automatic) at Easter!

pgt: Of the five people who signed up, two have been removed from the tournament because they could not read the rules. (No more than 60 current games)

http://brainking.com/game/Tournaments?trg=7518&trnst=0

This tournament is for players who are currently playing less than 60 games, and who PROMISE to make at least one move per day!!!

MidnightMcMedic: I have already run three "invitation only" tournaments in three weeks - all of which have finished within a few days. It's a very satisfying way of playing a tournament. It would just be nice to be able to play other people, and when the tournament is advertisesd as "1-day per move", not have players with 500 or so open games join the tournament and use the "automatic vacation" feature when they don't, won't, or can't move once a day like everybody else!

There was a discussion some time ago about having a tournament option with no vacation days and no automatic vacations. Has there been any progress on making this an option? It would certainly eliminate a lot of the gripes here, and those of us who like to play a few fast games would not be frustrated with long tedious boring dull tournaments (especially hyperbackgammn!) which go on for weeks and weeks, when 90% of the games are finished in a couple of days.

MidnightMcMedic: What the problem is is that paid memebers enter too many tournaments, play as many games as they want, but DON'T play as many games as they have signed up for, thus frustrating both paid AND unpaid members!

grenv: (And Stevie) I am also frustrated by players who join tournaments and won't move. I am currenltly playing in a "fast" Hyperbackgammon tournament, and most games have finished - it has been running 6 days. But ONE player HAS NOT MADE A SINGLE MOVE YET!! WHy would she enter the tournament? It is very frustrating. Can we PLEASE eliminate automatic vacations for tournaments so that selfish players cannot make 1 week tournaments stretch out ibnto boring three month affairs!! PLEASE!

Thad: Good thought Thad. I vote for that too!

Thanks Fencer - that should solve a lot of problems, and offer new options to faster players.

There was never any suggestion that the rules had been broken - just that the rules were ridiculous. If somebody wants to play 700 games concurrently that's fine, but by my calculations that's about 11 1/2 hours per day to make one move in each game - if it takes 1 minute per move. I agree with Grenv - I'm happy playing 20-30 games, remembering the thread of the game and any accompanying chat, and maintaining some semblence of "interactive sociability."

When I sign up for a tournament I like to feel that it will be played reasonably quickly - which is why I sign up for "fast start - 3 day" tournaments. I'd like to know that when a tournament starts it has a chance of finishing within a reasonable time.

I have no particular axe to grind about Arpa's general play, and have found him to play quickly - when we are both on line simultaneously. I suspect that he orders his VAST array of games to be played by selecting "next game with an on-line player", which means that should he be playing somebody on the other side of the world who only logs on for an hour a day, the chances of finding the opponent on line are very slim, and so the game never gets started.

I'd be more than happy to sign up for tournaments with the following characteristics, and wonder whether there are others out there in BK land who think these suggestions might have merit:

1. 1 or 2, or perhaps a maximum of 3 days per move. (excluding vacation and weekend)
2. No automatic vacation days.
3. No vacation days of any type allowed in the first 30 running days of ANY tournament.
4. Vacation days Cancelled for tournaments if the player has played ANY move in ANY game on the day in question.
5. No vacation days AT ALL in some tournaments - such as those limited to 5 players.

(Exceptions for BK breakdown, family emergency, ISP problems, Power cut etc to be granted by the game-owner on a case by case basis.)

People who want to play in a zillion tournaments concurrently can still do so under the existing tournament structure.

Nice one Grenv.

<Joke>DO we need "Drug" (addiction) tests like the Olympics? Say, if you can't name all the Tournaments you're currently playing, you get banned!!</Joke>

SunFire, if you read my original post, you will see that yesterday I moved up to Brain Rook effective 1st Jan - not a lot of point before then as I will be on vacation (Really :-) - which is one of the reasons I would have liked the tournament to be completed in the first place.
I only sign up for games and tournaments with MAX 3 day moves - that way I feel am playing games, and not just being a robot. And I'm very happy playing 20 to 30 games at a time. I moved up to Brain Rook to climb on this soap box. As a Brain Rook I feel as strongly about it as I ever did as a Brain Knight.

In the first instance I sent him a polite note asking him if there was a problem which prevented him playing.

He HAS subsequentlty managed to complete the game against me. But unlesss he starts and plays his OTHER three games, the tournament will never end, and he has certainly been signed on and playing games during the period in question.

I quote: "In Arpa's defence, I have played a hundred or so games with him and find his play to be timely, he moves at least once a day."

But there are AT LEAST 3 games which were started more than 14 days ago in which not a single move has been played!!

Is there room for me to stand on Grenv's soapbox?

Fencer, I think that that would be a GREAT idea - or maybe even restrict vacation days to 3,4 or 5 days for the ENTIRE tournament. But what I still don't understand is why anybody would want to sign up for a tournament and then not take part for three weeks. I think that's just completely inconsiderate.

I'm aware of the RULES. This country has some bloody stupid laws, too, but just because they are laws is no reason to lie down and accept them. They need to challenged if they are not the RIGHT rules.

I want to make some remarks on the following tournament.

Fast Start - First 5 to sign - Backgammon #575 (Backgammon)


The tournament was opened to start on 5th December, and today, 18th December, all of the games have been completed - except for one player, ARPA, who has not made a single move in three of the games.

I have repeatedly asked him politely if he would mind making some moves, but to no avail.

At the risk of being accused of taking a cheap ride, I have today upgraded my membership from Brain Knight to Brain Rook, so that I cannot be accused of sending this message for the wrong reasons. It is entirely reasonable for play restrictions to be imposed on those not contributing, or not contributing very much!

Now as a Brain Rook, I would like to state my case strongly! This tournament was advertised as "fast start" and in my simple mind, that also implied "fast play". I find absolutely no fun in playing tournments which last a month, let alone a year. I could well be dead before this tournamnet is over if ARPA does not make a move soon.

I checked up the games outstanding of the other player in the tournament, and they were 315, 80, 254, and 22. ARPA had 795 games outstanding! Why would somebody want to enter a tournament when that many games were outstanding? Did he REALLY intend to play in it?

IS THIS A FAIR THING FOR OTHER BK MEMBERS??

I'd love to hear your views.