as a side note, I took advantage of perpetual and hated myself for it. couldn't sleep for a week. Forbidding it will absolve me and save my immortal soul.

Fencer, given the popularity of xiangqi and shogi and their accompanying rules of being forced to break off perpetual check, I think it's high time the lack of perpetual move rule was applied to jungle. It's actually a great game, but it is too easy to draw games even with severe material imbalances. The only reason it doesn't have it is that it is treated as a kids' game in China and kids usually don't have the wherewithal to get pissy about draws like I am getting now.

ScarletRose: i don't begrudge you the right to play unrated games, why should you return the favor to us who do want to play rated games. You say you want to have fun? Well, my definition of fun generally doesn't involve playing someone 1000 points higher or lower than me in a particular game, it usually is too easy or too hard, and no fun. How do I know this? From the ratings.

Fencer: using that formula, as Walter pointed out, many legitimate players will be hurt as well. The cheaters can circumvent it by creating more accounts. Ultimately, you will deal with them on a case-by-case basis, there is no blanket solution to this problem.

Fencer, for the gammons, ESPECIALLY HYPER, instead of seeing the win ratio stats for white/black, could we see the wins based on the player moving first vs. the player moving second? The way it's currently set up, black and white are irrelevant because they have no bearing on the order of play, which is determined randomly.

Stevie: i don't think it matters. Sumerian uses a computer to play (in tournaments with $500 US prizes) but no one condemns him..maybe because he admits it openly in his profile?

BIG BAD WOLF: you can cheat at any other game just as easily...chess and checkers world class programs are regularly used on this site already!

just create a new game and mention in the blurb that it's unrated etc., that way you avoid irking anyone who naturally assumes the games are rated.

ok, i definitely think our signals are crossed here. In bughouse, it is really team loop chess the way you describe it, andreas?
I was referring to pure tandem chess in which wo teams of two players play the same game, which is only chess, no loop aspect involved at all. And, as ughiabu said, OTB it is usually played without consultation, that is, without one partner able to verbalize a plan to the other partner. If they can talk, I believe it is called consultation chess. Well, as with program use, there is no way to prevent consultation on BK, so there would be a gentleman's agreement not to consult in tandem, or else not regulate consultation at all. Either way it can't be enforced. So, actually, Caissus, I was advocating tandem chess because it is still linear. ie person a moves, then b, then c. No unusual waits. But in bughouse, you would have to figure out whether to synchronize play or not, but of course this could be easily programmed.

Both tandem and bughouse would be great additions. I would be happy to beta either one.

yes, good point Uwe! can be quite popular in certain clubs!

Any chance of implementing tandem chess, Fencer? I'll be happy to beta test!

having more variety can only add to the site, ditto on the proposal. Why not expand the horizons and choices?

also, are Korean/Chinese Chess still on the block?

Fencer, when creating a tournament, how about an option to include all games and/or all from a certain category (per the way the discussion boards are cateogized, that way we wouldn't have to manually check every box.

there's some logic to that, i guess!

Fencer, for Espionage, could you please add a captured pieces window?

ok, everything makes sense re the mice and elephants. But what do you mean by long and short jumps/ Do you mean jumping over two bodies of water or is the distinction horizontal and vertical? Both lions and tigers can jump over only one river at a time, but can jump either horizontally or vertically. But the rules I posted below only mention jumping ability for lions and tigers, and furthermore the applet itself won't permit it, so I think they're landbound.

And yes, this looks ridiculous so someone who hasn't been following the thread. But I'm itching to play now! Fencer, will your version have numbers beside the animals or an index either by the side of the board or in the rules?

because there's the specific prohibition against the mouse killing the elephant on land, I would assume it's otherwise ok, so probably ok for a mouse to kill a mouse from the water. i tried in the program and the AI keeps avoiding giving me the opportunity, so I assume it is possible. A looped version...you mean with total free rein on where to place captured animals? Interesting...!

ugh, I could, but their answer wouldn't be definitive either. I'm going to try and get a set locally, but lately Koreans have been distancing themselves from things Chinese, so it might be hard to find. At any rate, Cariad, yes, a mouse can jump in the river and eat another mouse. But the question is what about when they're both already in the river? That's up in the air..

OK， I got a copy of the rules in Chinese for "Jungle" (literally translated as animal fighting chess). I'll post it below for reference, mostly for myself and other Sinophones if any discrepancies arise.

Most of the rules jibe with what Cariad copied. Anyway, ugh is right, an elephant can't eat a mouse. A mouse may not eat an elephant from the river. All sorts of leaps (horizontal, vertical) are ok for tigers and lions and they can eat other animals which may happen to be on the landing square. Mouse eating mouse when both in the river wasn't covered in the rules below. The rules I found weren't comprehensive, in fact they were on the download page for the shareware. The problem is that there is no 兽斗棋 federation to make the rules official. Anyone interested in downloading the shareware can follow this link

http://www.onlinedown.com/soft/18859.htm

click on the hyperlink right of the green arrow for a shareware program where you play "the computer." I've tried to get the program to jump into the river with its mouse to see if it can eat my mouse, but to no avail.

Animal(斗兽棋)—小时候常玩的动物棋。小时候总会喜欢和邻居的小孩子一起玩陆军棋、动物棋这些小但是好玩的游戏，也许你已经很久没玩了，还记得这类好玩的游戏吗？现在让这款游戏帮你重现小时候的回忆吧！在这个试用版中，你的对手是计算机，整个游戏画面是分为两块区域，一边是你的动物，另一边是计算机的动物，中间有河流分割两块区域，有三座桥梁可以让彼此的动物过河，要取得胜利，必须占领计算机那一边动物的巢穴获胜利。要移动动物，将鼠标指针移到该动物上，按鼠标左键，即可选择要行进的方向，一次只能行走一步，若是要更换动物，可以按鼠标右键，或是直接到另一个动物上按鼠标左键。除此之外，狮子和老虎可以跳跃过河流，老鼠则可以游过河流，不一定非要从桥梁过河，而且当老鼠在河中的时候，可以阻挡狮子和老虎跳过。 你在动物旁边可以看到数字，代表这个动物的强弱，你可以捕食在你旁边格子里数字一样或是比你小的动物，但唯一例外的是，老鼠可以“捕食”大象。所以你要仔细思考，运用最好的攻击方式，一举攻陷计算机的巢穴！。适合5岁以上儿童。

hmm is Alquerque still in development as it says above? heh...

Fencer, how about a way to sort waiting tournaments by days per move. It's easier to skip over the ridiculous 12 and 21 day per move tourneys if they're at the bottom of the list.

auto pass could work on this site, but i think the key is more in finding opponents who like to play quickly if that's what you're after. Many top players on this site (including ughaibu!) will finish a game in one session.

yes, since the site essentially thrives on the popularity of the games offered, it makes perfect sense to me to let the members choose which game should be priorized to be added next.

Upchuck makes a good point. Google likes 10,500 more than 2000 or whatever the "real" number is. I'm not even talking about deleting accounts, really. This is about ACTIVE players who acquire a ridiculous provisional rating and then stop playing. ie, they don't defend their titles. That irks me, but that's all it is, just an annoyance. Without naming names, all you have to do is compare prov to est ratings with # of games played for certain ppl and you'll see what I mean..

Fencer, do you ever delete (pawn) accounts that are inactive for more than a certain period of time, say a year?

I must agree with BOTH of you on this. Yes, the ratings are ridiculously high or low sometimes, and not that meaningful. But when exactly should they been shown anyway? To me, 4 is as good an arbitrary # as any. I think, Uwe, you just have to take them for what they are: provisional BKR ratings that have no meaning outside of this site. However, on this site, they are obviously meaningful to some people who have played just 4 games and then refuse to take challenges..

some variants would be difficult to pull off logistically. I think I can see Fencer's reasoning, too. Some of the variants aren't popular, so to make a subvariant might be a waste of time. I'm still itching to see Janus Extinction, but honestly, Janus and Extinction aren't popular by themselves, so the combined variant probably wouldn't catch on. I do think, Fencer, that you should use the POLLS feature to decide the next game....and i say this unselfishly, since it'll probably be something I don't vote for anyway..but that way you'll give the ppl what they want. Ok, i'm gonna go read some Che Guevera.

I like experimenting with new variants of just about everything. I know there are plenty of feature requests to Fencer for new games, but he is only one person and can only program so fast. However, the goth board and other chess variants are already programmed on BK, so it wouldn't take too much more time to combine the two. I believe Goth would combine very well with other variants, especially extinction, loop, dark (!!), 3 checks, anti and maaaybe atomic (we'd have to see if white has too great of an advantage). I would love to see those combined variants.

change your browser's default language and they should appear. In IE, it's view, encoding etc.

that shows up perfectly on my screen too. What software are you using? I use 南极星. Without it open, my browser may "guess" wrong which language is being used. Important for you, because 日本语 also uses 汉字

안녕하세요

Ok, ugh, I can see these, can you?

let me try: 你们看不看见我写什么？

shogi desu ka?

andersp: of course i meant native speakers, i didn't mean to bash anyone learning a new language

grenv: good point about scarface. Children imitate what they are exposed to...therefore, it was an excellent decision to censor the swearing instead of the violence. That way the kids will speak "cleanly" as they evisercate, which is all the more sanitized. Sarcasm aside, it takes a certain type of parent to let a preschooler watch all kinds of TV, esp Scarface, unsupervised, which was the point. As for a real feature request, based on his comment, I nominate grenv to moderate whatever he likes!

personally, i am much more offended by incorrect spelling and grammar than "bad words", but if everyone can agree it's not ok in public and ok on private boards, then the distinction needs to clearly delineated. What some would consider to be personal attacks were merely considered as harmelss comments on the gothic chess board. Ultimately, everything is subjective here, with so many cultures and languages.

umm..hate to interrupt, but do you think you can program Alice Chess, Fencer? just a small request.