Sam makes a good opint. Why are the players who have little pente experience so unwilling to trust that the players with LOTS of experience might actually know what they are talking about?

samwise: I never claimed to be good at pente, no did i claim to know the game well. Even so, i agree with you in regards to the opening restriction. The advantage is quite obvious without it for the first player. But as Dmitri has confirmed, very few games would be confined by the edges if played on a 13x13 board. And especially against new players, the edge will not be a factor. So besides it not being invented that way, none of you have said why a 13x13 board is "wrong".

Dmitri: I do trust players with experience, and i believe you, samwise and Gary are all very experienced. If any of you can come up with a good reason why a 13x13 board is "wrong" (besides it not being invented that way) for casual competition, i will gladly support it. But for now, i see nothing wrong with playing on a 13x13 board.

Kevin, I thought I gave several reasons already for why the 13 X 13 board is no good for pente. I don't wish to repeat myself. As you mentioned, few games will be affected, BUT those that ARE affected will be affected dramatically, in a way that was NOT intended! How much mroe reason do you need? So far, no one has provided ANY reason FOR the 13 X 13 board! You seem to think the fact that pente was intended for play on a large board is a trivial detail... it isn't! it is an important part of the game. Also, you say beginning playewrs would not be affected by the edge of the board at all.

1) how are you arriving at that conclusion?
2) if so, THEN WHY BOTHER?

3) Kevin, you are belaboring a DEAD ISSUE here, the 13 X 13 board has already been acknowledged to be necessary because of the WEB TV users. That said, there is NO other reson for the 13 X 13 board, and you certainly have NOt presented any. you have said there is nothing wrong with it, despite the repeated explanations of exactly what is wrong with it. By your logic, there is nothing "wrong" with a 12X12, 14X14, 15X15. AND SO ON. we would have a dozen "variants" all with different sized boards, for no discernible reason.

At this opint the debate has shifted to why the restriction was lifted for the small boards. Web TV users do not require that extra change, so I don't see the need for it. A.lso, maybe the 13X 13 game could be called "webTV pente" or beter yet, "WebTV 5inLine." Then the game currently called "5inLine" can be given itsp roper title of "Go-Moku"