That is the thing I noticed about one of the top players - I started to watch all their moves, to see how I could improve my game. For the first 5 moves or so, their bid were always higher then mine - nothing that would get them the bonus, but enough to start putting them further down the list.

Then all of a sudden, Boom - there they were at the end challenging for the win.

So yes, taking big chances may increase your chance to win - but I've noticed being nice and stedy - no real big chances will leave you with much beter chances of wins at the end. (in which my rate of wins has been increasing some I believe - took me forever to get to ten, and now all of a sudden I'm getting close to 20)

Vikings: Well in that case, if I was Pedro i would take 3rd place. If I was Vikings, I would get ready to end up in 2nd place. If I was Maxxina, I would already be counting my BKR points gained by yet another win.

..... since you asked. :-)

Maxxina: Well I never said it was going to be simple. O'wait - I did. TWICE!

Simple - Bid either between 1-478 point more then Vikings bid

or

bid 524 points less then Vikings. (While still bidding above tonyh)

Simple!

I'm guessing that the BKR changes once the tournament is complete. Going to be a big hit for some in the "first run" pond. Luckly, I'm still going.

I love that their is a rating now for a pond, but I can already tell you that having the persons BKR rating on the actual pond game IS going to mess some up when they mean to look at "points left", and look at the BKR instead and make a bad bid.

How about moving the BKR rating to the left of the players name (next to the order) - and not next to the points left.

It's in the same place as the tournament winners list (just 2 options near top - tournaments & ponds)

Link for "Winners" on menu under "Team tournaments", and above "Ratings"

I see that Irishrose had 2900 last round, and bet 2900 - which should have given her 500 bonus, but ended up with 5,000 bonus!

grenv: That is the thing that bothers me - if there is that few people left, that information is sitting right there for me to look at - don't know how I could miss it.

... I can understand if 10+ people are left, since the last person might not be on the same screen as I am and I might miss something.....

Ugh... i just can't believe i did something so stupid - which is why I REALLY want to look at past moves in pond games since I've seen similar in other games - just usually I don't mess up that bad. :-(

furbster: That is kind of what I guessed - and to make it worse, the last person bid like 3000 - so I did not even get the bonus! Yea.... Ugh.

Note to self: Always take an extra 10 seconds to look at everyones total, and make sure no one had turned into a pawn.

33 hours and counting - That is when I will join the 10 win club! *grabs a banana and does a happy dance*

Oh, and I agree that the "you win the bonus message" is not really needed - it's kind of like if you get a message every time you are put in check in chess - something you will find out as soon as you look at the game.

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?p=0&g=285

Wow, I've never seen the last 3 players have so much left at the end. 3 players left, all with over 11,000 point left each!

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=5

I like the above pond - 6 people were left, 1 with 0 points - so all the other 5 had to do was bid 1 to make it to the next round. 4 of the 5 tried higher bids to get the 500 bonus. Just kind of funny how many of us go for the bonus rather then play it safe sometimes.

Well I'm not sure who you are talking about, but:

1) The person may be new - not knowing what they are doing yet. Since you can't search previous moves, a new player has no way to really search a game to "learn" how to play.

2) The person may be going on vacation - and making a big enough bid that it will hopefully keep him in the game until he gets back.

I believe it is planned that you can look at past moves - and I hope it is something that will happen sometime soon..... there is a lot of information there that I could use to help learn how others play the game which will in turn help my game.

kitti: But also remember there are 100's of players who have not even won a pond, so are not even on the list - so even making the list is a great accomplisment!

Yea - I thought I was doing much better then I am (win 1 out of every 17 I enter) - I did not relize I have already completed that many ponds.

... and again, that does not include ponds which are still going (even if someone is out of the game). - sorry, not going to dig that deep to get those stats. :-)

Well I got to wondering on who is playing the "best" pond game so far, so I gathered some of my own stats. These "stats" are from completed games as of today - gathered from only those who have already won at least 1 pond. (So if a player is out of a pond but the pond is still going - that did not go into these stats.)

Name -- ponds completed -- wins -- win 1 pond out of XX ponds entered
== == == == == == == == == == == == ==

1 raduz - - - 1 - - - 1 - - - 1
2 Mike UK - - - 5 - - - 2 - - - 2.5
3 ClayNashvilleTn - - - 4 - - - 1 - - - 4
4 NOT a floosie - - - 4 - - - 1 - - - 4
5 Partica - - - 4 - - - 1 - - - 4
6 Windy - - - 4 - - - 1 - - - 4
7 furbster - - - 34 - - - 8 - - - 4.25
8 Pedro Martínez - - - 98 - - - 20 - - - 4.9
9 Vikings - - - 93 - - - 17 - - - 5.470588235
10 Czuch Chuckers - - - 49 - - - 8 - - - 6.125
11 rebelyell - - - 7 - - - 1 - - - 7
12 Maxxina - - - 115 - - - 15 - - - 7.666666667
13 Flake - - - 80 - - - 10 - - - 8
14 rabbitoid - - - 35 - - - 4 - - - 8.75
15 Priscilla - - - 9 - - - 1 - - - 9
16 aissi - - - 40 - - - 4 - - - 10
17 Sinay - - - 30 - - - 3 - - - 10
18 venuse - - - 10 - - - 1 - - - 10
19 jitkasafa - - - 21 - - - 2 - - - 10.5
20 zockerdotcom - - - 32 - - - 3 - - - 10.66666667
21 Jofaserimon - - - 44 - - - 4 - - - 11
22 Nightstorm - - - 11 - - - 1 - - - 11
23 Mely - - - 35 - - - 3 - - - 11.66666667
24 pgt - - - 12 - - - 1 - - - 12
25 Tina Maurencova - - - 12 - - - 1 - - - 12
26 drgnrdr - - - 14 - - - 1 - - - 14
27 Monica - - - 14 - - - 1 - - - 14
28 Pbarb2 - - - 14 - - - 1 - - - 14
29 TheBig O - - - 14 - - - 1 - - - 14
30 Luisifer - - - 15 - - - 1 - - - 15
31 Jason - - - 31 - - - 2 - - - 15.5
32 Nothingness - - - 16 - - - 1 - - - 16
33 BIG BAD WOLF - - - 85 - - - 5 - - - 17
34 macik - - - 17 - - - 1 - - - 17
35 tonyh - - - 55 - - - 3 - - - 18.33333333
36 Daniel Snyder - - - 37 - - - 2 - - - 18.5
37 ScarletRose - - - 37 - - - 2 - - - 18.5
38 Backoff - - - 38 - - - 2 - - - 19
39 pawnme - - - 21 - - - 1 - - - 21
40 Labbeda - - - 44 - - - 2 - - - 22
41 Mach Machovic - - - 98 - - - 4 - - - 24.5
42 Bry - - - 75 - - - 3 - - - 25
43 Erinity - - - 26 - - - 1 - - - 26
44 Bobes - - - 29 - - - 1 - - - 29
45 Stevie - - - 33 - - - 1 - - - 33
46 kitti - - - 38 - - - 1 - - - 38
47 fra - - - 79 - - - 2 - - - 39.5
48 eleonora - - - 46 - - - 1 - - - 46
49 Hannelore - - - 54 - - - 1 - - - 54
50 Arctic Warrior - - - 110 - - - 1 - - - 110
51 Bad Bishop - - - ?? - - - 1 - - - ??
52 stromovous - - - ?? - - - 1 - - - ??

So some interesting results so far. (and again, just from completed ponds - no currently running ponds were included in these stats.)

Vikings: I think I'll try that.

*puts some numbers on some cards*
*goes outside*
*throws them into the air*
*shots at them*

OK, so if I did not hit any of them, does that mean I should bid 0?

*grin* - Yea, I like to tell people my strategy - so when it serves me the best, I can change it and surprise my opponent - Muhahahahaha!

After doing some math for about 5 minutes, I now have a bid in this game: http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=247

Or did I bid the min to hopefully get Vikings to overbid - or did I just throw a random number out there - Muhahahahaha

.... and another interesting game between you (Vikings) and me

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=247

1 Vikings 6583
2 BIG BAD WOLF 6512
3 HoneyLo 500

... now how can I outsmart you and end up with more points........


UGH - Way too much thinking in my games!

Yea, I'm happy with my position - but with 4 players left, it's basicly anyones game.

I mean what to bid? Can't bid too much or you will not have enough left to last the next couple rounds.... not bid enough, and you are wet.

Ugh..... the stress!

Interesting Game: http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=243

It's me, and 3 others - and the 3 others just happen to be the 3 with the most wins each! - All 4 of us within 500 points of each other.

.... don't even ask me what I'm going to do here - I have no idea!

current score:
1 BIG BAD WOLF 6979
2 Pedro Martínez 6829
3 Vikings 6502
4 Maxxina 6500

Stevie: um..... ok... don't ever remember giving you a "so" reply when you moan about something you have worked weeks on getting setup to work for your advantage, but whatever??

To say that ponds should only be about the numbers only is like saying Battleboats should be just about randomly shooting.

Yet in Battleboats, to use extra strategy can help you a lot - for example knowing if a person likes to place boats along the outside walls can eliminate a lot of searching. Knowing that a person never puts boats next to each other will also elimitante a lot of searching.

So to use extra strategy in ponds can also be helpful - for example, knowing who may try to bid high to get the 500 bonus - or know that a person almost always bids the same amount in the first round or so - or to know how much higher another person usually bids over the person who just fell into the pond are all extra strategys that a person can take (AND WILL BE VERY HELPFULL once we can see past moves in all ponds.) So to also see if a person has even been around to make a bid is also another strategy that can be used.

I like the auto-bid, and may allow a player to continue if they are unable to make it in every day. To hide the players or something like that would basicly take much of the strategy involved with the game away.

not complaining.... just.... Um.... OK, was complaing, but I know it won't help anything.

New server?

Well I did not like it either, BUT when you see others getting a very big advantage from doing this - well it's either join in or fall behind. :-(

... and now in those 10+ ponds, it may now just be the perfect time for someone else to take advantage of this and now put myself at a bigger disadvantage in those ponds.

But before the round is over, if I'm actually awake (which I made sure I was for all the ponds I started) - I will sometimes go through and see if any of the other players have been away for the past 24 hours (meaning they will auto-bid) - which would help me out in the pond. Of course now I'm not going to get up at 3am to check this.

Ugh.... Yup, a lot of my ponds now have the start/end time as about 3am my time - about the worse it can be now. :-(

yea, I know - hopefully it is during a good time for me - I usually purposly start my own ponds at a time I know I'll be on-line - so I can always make sure I will be able to play.

None of the "hourly" tasks are running currently I don't think.

Walter Montego: You know that would probable be a good move - it's been awhile since someone has bid 0 or 1 - so a bid of 2 or 3 should be good! I think I'll go do that!

Yea, I've noticed the 500 point bonus was actually being won by lower bidders also - but at the same time it just seems way too early for me to drop any further then I need to. Near 100 players left - around the top 20 - within a couple hundered points - no need to risk too much.

I just can't wait for the round after this (that is after the 19 bids fall) - Do you take a chance and bid 21 in the hopes that someone who bid 20 does not change their bid - or bid 22 in the hopes that some people did bet 21 - or bid 23 to stay above the ones who bid 22 in the hopes that someone bid 21!

I have not looked at the pond yet so as not to "help" too much, but I will give a general example of what I normally do when 3 players are left in a pond.

Example #1:
Player 1: 5000 points left
Player 2: 4600 points left
Player 3: 1000 points left

If I was player 3, I normally will bet everything I have left. I mean for Player 3, he will most likey be in 3rd place - and if by some-how one of the top 2 bid below my total, I would then move up to 2nd place overall.

Now if I was player 2, this is where it gets interested - since less then 500 seperates player 1 & 2, the 500 point bonus may be the key. I would take a guess that player 1 would bid the min to stay alive - 1,001 in this case - so as player 2, I would probable play 1,100 - which if that gives me the 500 point bonus, would leave me 1 point ahead.

If I was player #1, I would again assume that player #2 will at least play the min to stay alive - 1,001. And since I'm already ahead by 400, I would bid around 1,400 - hopefully enough to keep the bonus away from the other player.

With less then 500 points between the 1st & 2nd place - it can be VERY tricky!

Example #2

Player #1: 5,000
Player #2: 4,000
Player #3: 3,000

As player #3, the same as before - I would bet 3,000. As player #2, it is almost impossible to win. When more then 500 points are between the 2, player #1 can just bid the min to stay alive (3,001) and even if player #2 gets the 500 bonus - it still does not matter. The only way that player #1 can lose is if both Player #2 and Player #3 bid well below the total that player #3 has.

Well you do know redsales you are in a men's only fellowship called the cave - is that segregation?

.... yea I know, getting off topic from Ponds now...

It's always been like that - heck, Ponds are only for knights and above, and pawns are not allowed.

Arctic Warrior: At time like that I wish I could look back 1 round to see if maybe they had 0 points left to bid or something...

Pedro Martínez: Wow - Looks like it might be the first pond with no winner! (If the last bids are the same, everyone falls into the pond and there is no winner!)

... at least I would think both of you would bid the max, but I have seen stranger things.

http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=179

10 players left - 10 players in the pond, and one of the closet games - less then 600 points between the 10 remaining players.

... but also brings me to a question - Is the limitation for ponds in place for Knights?

And hopefully the membership detail page can be updated with this information - http://brainking.com/game/PaidMembership?p=1

Pawns could never join ponds - some pawns are in tournaments now since their membership ran out after they were in, but they are unable to actually move in those ponds.

Let me try

grenv: Lets say for example I'm one once a day - 9am to about 10am.

I come online at 9am on Tuesday, I make a move in the pond at 9:05am, but have to leave right away.

Just happen to be the last one, move is sent, 1 day limit starts.

Wednesday - I'm a little late, I do not get on until 9:30am - OPPS, the day limit is gone in the pond game and my auto-bid made me fall into the pond.

(hopefully that example will work a little bit beter)

Zorro: Well as more people get use to playing, the bids are some-what changing.

I and others are surprised on how low the first few rounds of bidding are. (We got spoiled by the first big pond). At first, bids as low as 10-15 were safe of the first rounds. Now it's up to about 20-25, and even seen some 30's fall in the pond in the first round. Sooner or later, I would expect all first round bids to be over 100 (but that is still a little ways away.)

Also for each round after that (until you get about 5-7 people left), a very rough thing I see is the low bid doubleing every time. That is if 30 fell into the pond last round, well then anything below 60 probable would not be safe. Then if 60 fell in, then anything under 120 would not be safe. **** AGAIN, just a very rough estimate, don't just bid double+1 and expect to be safe. ****

I wasn't going to post, but I can't think of one good reason to bet zero rather then just bet 10 and fall into the pond at the same time as the lowest bidder. Betting 10 or 0 would give the same result of leaving the first run.

I can't wait until we can look through past moves.

I've very curious in THIS POND how I've ended up with about 2,000 more points then everyone else

Myself, if Fencer can find a good way to do ratings for the Pond game, then good.

But I would be happy with just having some cool "stats" on the game for each person.

For example:
Total amount of (finished) ponds entered:
Total wins: (amount & percent)
Total top 5's: (amount & percent)
Average fall time: (In percentage - so 50% means you make it 1/2 way through the pond - 8 place in a pond of 16 players, or 50th place in a pond of 100 players)

etc.... and any other cool stats we can think of.

Then possible have some list of "best users" after completing 25 ponds according to % wins or % of top fives

Well this is the problems with all "multi-player" games, which this just happens to be the first one on BK.

It's hard to determin "who played beter" - so the best, just like any major sport - Take the score at the end of the game and go from there.

I understand what Bry is saying, but will have to disagree.

For example, I know if a few ponds I took a chance with some higher bids to hopefully get the 500 point bonus to shot me in the lead - which when failed, left me far behind.

So now my goal is to last as long as possible to end up as high as possible - which means less chances by me, and meaning I will probable end up higher then some who took more chances. I don't see anything wrong with this.

The pond in question: http://brainking.com/game/Pond?g=126&trnst=10