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this is a board that talks about issues concerning animals...your own pets as well as animal rights,alerts,bills before congress that need our attention.This is a family board but as abuse cases may be posted it may not always be for the sensitive readers.Please be kind to each other,thanks!


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8. May 2008, 13:40:21
anastasia 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Jim Dandy: I have never been overly keen on horse racing.I DO understand these animlas are bred and born to run...so,with that said...I guess I would be MORE ok with the sport IF changes were made (see petition I asked people to sign a few posts ago)
I think that they should run the horses on surfaces that are a bit softer on the legs/joints of the horses.
Waiting until the horse is done growing..I don't know much about horses,not going to sit here and pretend that I do,but I have read at the age this female was at,her bones/joints were not fully formed? Why not wait until they ARE? I don't go taking my dogs jumping and climbing the wall at a young age because the joints are still like jelly,WHY take a chance on causing more damage?
And also the whipping part...OMG,ever since I was little I have HATED how the jockey whips the horse.IF they insist on keeping this as part of the race then after the race is over,the jockey should also be whipped as many times as he whipped that horse.
I think these are some little things the industry could look at,maybe change some way of doing things so that everyone involved is happy and so that the horses can do what the horses were born to do,but be SAFER while doing it....anymore thoughts on this???

9. May 2008, 20:48:00
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
anastasia: I used to get literally dragged to the track,I was never a fan of horse racing,but I did learn much about the people and culture of the sport.Those people can talk horses 24/7,and they really do obsess over their horses.I'm all for anything that improves the safety of both horse and driver or jockey,but I don't think horse racing should be banned.Too often the spotlight is put on something due to a rare incident causing people to overreact,I think this qualifies

10. May 2008, 04:35:27
wetware 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Jim Dandy:  I'd rather not debate with you as to whether such incidents are "rare", since that word is vague and we'd quickly get nowhere.

But I think a horse facing a 1/500 chance of dying as a result of a race is facing quite a risk.

10. May 2008, 04:49:11
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
wetware: Do yo have any idea how many racetracks there are in North America? let alone Asia and the rest of the world.An average racing card is say 10 races,with on average say 8 horses.Based on your calculations,my local track would have(for small) 1 euthanization a week?

Horses get bumps and bruises just like any athlete,and sometimes they never race again,but very very very rarely are they euthenized,and frankly,just like in Barbaro's case,it's to save them a painful death.

I haven't seen this issue raised often,just like those who say "kill all the rotwieller's" when a death occurs,it's knee jerk reactionary behavior.

10. May 2008, 04:56:45
wetware 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Modified by wetware (10. May 2008, 05:19:14)
Jim Dandy: I believe the actual stats are about 2 per day here in the U.S.  I'm not trying to be reactionary or alarmist--just presenting the numbers.

As far as the sources of the numbers, I think that here in the U.S. we've only got really solid stats from the following tracks (participants in the on-track injury reporting system):
Albuquerque
Aqueduct
Arlington Park
Bay Meadows
Belmont Park
Calder Race Course
Canterbury Park
Churchill Downs
Colonial Downs
Del Mar
Delaware Park
Delta Downs
Ellis Park
Emerald Downs
Evangeline Downs
Fair Grounds
Fonner Park
Golden Gate
Gulfstream Park
Hawthorne Race Course
Hollywood Park
Hoosier Park
Indiana Downs
Keeneland Racing Association
Kentucky Downs
Laurel Park
Lone Star Park
Louisiana Downs
Meadowlands
Monmouth Park
Oak Tree Racing Association
Penn National
Pimlico Race Course
Philadelphia Park
Portland Meadows
Prairie Meadows
Presque Isle Downs
Remington Park
Retama Park
Sam Houston Race Park
Santa Anita Park
Saratoga
Suffolk Downs
Thistledown
Timonium
Turfway Park
Woodbine
Woodlands
Yavapai Downs

I think I may have made a mistake in understanding what constitutes a "start".  I took that to mean each individual horse in a race, whereas the stats might apply to each individual race (no matter how many horses are in it).  The best current numbers for dirt tracks are almost exactly 2 deaths per 1,000 "starts".

Others can argue about what is rare or excessive.  I'm taking an agnostic stance for the moment, until I've got more solid information.

10. May 2008, 05:16:05
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
wetware: I'm not trying to be argumentitive,but based on the number of race tracks in the states,your stats don't add up.Each track has about 80 horses racing per day

10. May 2008, 05:22:07
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
wetware: It's hard to isolate on the facts when the ratio changes,anyway,we can agree to disagree

10. May 2008, 05:51:45
wetware 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Jim Dandy:  To my mind, that potentially variable meaning of "starts" won't lead to informative statistics.  FYI, I tended to take numbers presented to the Welfare and Safety of the Racehorse Summit(s).  Those strike me as the most reliable I've seen (even though they wound up having to revise some of the data).  Otherwise, I think there's just too much state-to-state variation, if the numbers aren't comparable.  I wouldn't even dare to look at data outside the U.S., other than to say that jumping races are far more deadly.

I miss chatting with one of my curling mates.  She's quite the horsewoman and loves hers dearly.  I'd love to hear her opinions on some of these matters.

10. May 2008, 05:59:00
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
wetware: There are probably more racetracks in Asia than the USA,not to mention Canada.I just don't see race tracks to be the "killing fields" some are depicting them to be,or the sport deemed worthy of banning.I have zero interest in the sport,but my mom's folks raised show horses and my dad owned standard breds,he kissed them on the nose before every race or after,no matter the result

10. May 2008, 06:31:02
awesome 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Jim Dandy:

that brings back memories of Niatross....if not for car trouble I would have made it to Batavia Downs in 1980 when he ran a 1:55 mile on a half mile track....

10. May 2008, 06:44:20
The Col 
Subject: Re: But at least they TRIED to help him ..... true?
Modified by The Col (10. May 2008, 06:45:40)
awesome: Amazingly,thoroughbred times haven't dropped much in the last 30 or more years,in harness racing a 2 minute mile was once the litmus test of greatness,now they run around 1:50,and that evolved over around 10 years or less.I don't know what that says in breed comparisons,or if it is shown that harness horses are more brittle,frankly all I know about racing was due to overexposure lol

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