Artful Dodger: As I watched it, I got the idea that the Canadians were taking a year off as they are 'depleted in supplies and working vehicles.'

Then to take the mickey like that, especially after Canada stopped terrorists from entering the USA.

Similar problems have occurred here in the UK, with our troops having inadequate equipment, or more seriously now.. Our Nimrods need a major overhaul due to major safety issues.

We had a case over here, where two guys made a bad joke. One had to resign, the other got suspended for several months.

... and they both said sorry.

Artful Dodger: I didn't see an argument, just how such comments can be made regarding a friendly powers soldiers who are fighting side by side with yours and my country's soldiers can be made on a TV station.

Quite frankly, it doesn't matter where it came from, but it was done.

It's bad form. Even us 'liberals' over here... except in a small number.. respect and love our troops and that of other country's fighting this war against terrorism.

Over here if such a broadcast was made, the company responsible will find themselves in court and probably lynched by a few million people descending on their offices. The regulatory body, who upholds complaints against a broadcaster will find their phone system overloaded with calls.

... It'd be raised in Parliament. Also every other company who broadcasts or prints will be condemning it. We'd probably do a petition for that companies licence to broadcast be revoked... And I recon the PM would say yes.. revoke it.

Artful Dodger: opinion. info, matter of interest, etc, etc, etc.

I didn't think we had to be on target all the time.

You are saying that in 1935 a bill was rejected to criminalise lynching!!!

That is barbaric. Maybe they should have hung Roosevelt for a few seconds for him to feel what it is like. I am shocked!!

The Usurper: .... It's a £1000 fine if you don't register here on the electoral register. I asked a government lackey once why we needed to.. he didn't know. Strange as he worked for the dept responsible.

Artful Dodger: It was related. It was about women being in power. Which is becoming a more common thing. Gone are the days of women not having souls, and women not having a vote, or unequal pay (wellll.. that one is still problematic).. but still... that one will come in time.

And it's more then a generation later Obama came into power since African Americans were hung from trees I hope. That was barbaric that people within a democracy could do such a thing to it's own citizens.

Bernice: Nahhh.... being a puppet is quite usual. Taking orders from the party is quite usual..... you should check up on the UK system. On certain votes, the parties use what is known as the "whip" to make MP's vote for the policy they want to pass through Parliament. Same to a degree in local government, but at that level there is more chance of independents and alliances.

Bernice: Not really... She is in charge of Queensland isn't she? She's not a puppet??

Artful Dodger: I know... as nations we don't respect people's rights so we are not ready. I just hope we have to have a 'Titanic' to change that attitude.

Czuch: A world government is many decades away. The idea and work to guarantee that peoples rights are still respected in a country as part of a 'world' government are very much a not sorted item. How do I know this... from the EU. If they can't get it right (as they don't alot) then there is no way I could see a world government happening.

For now... we best stick to the UN and conventions like the Geneva.

Bwild: Probably.... But as I said, she ain't the first women as a leader of a area or country. But it is nice that women are getting more in places of leadership.

Bernice: You forgot about Maggie Thatcher, plus many other women who've been in a position of leader of their countries.

Snoopy: It's easy to learn, although I do admit one of our maths teachers was very hot on mental arithmetic, and I did technical drawing so I had to know some basic conversions. Plus our log books, etc had at the back conversion tables so picking it up was quite easy.

I like Imperial, but can work in metric and back if needed.

Czuch: My only gripe is in that bottled ale (real beer) is done mostly in 500ml bottles.. only a few do a full pint (568ml)

Shame..

Snoopy: It's not confusing for the kids if the parents (like us) teach them both metric and imperial and how to convert easily between them.

And when I went to school we got taught both and how to convert. 2.2 (approx) pounds per kilo and a pound is 454 grams. Same for liquids and measuring height and length.

.... Also it appears when it comes to markets then the rules over weights display is not so rigid. The fruit n' veg and meat stalls still use pounds, no sign of kilos.

The Usurper: Such a change would require the people to be informed before and a referendum taken on how the people feel.

It's why the Brit Gov won't try to force the Euro on us as a currency, Us Brits like the pound. They tried to make us give up the pound as in weight for the kilo... didn't work.... We still love our old imperial weights and measures.

The Usurper: I expect that the plan will meet with stiff resistance... very stiff

I can understand maybe better trade relations if needed, after all them being your next door neighbours it makes sense. But that is it.

The Usurper: I've been interested and watching governments in the UK since I learnt economics at school. Our teacher knew that Maggies' boom and bust policy of economic growth was gonna fail and we'd be knee deep in it. Since then I've watched as opposition parties have said "that's a bad idea" but not changed policy on the "'bad idea' or stopped it.

It's like they just wanna mouth each other off so they can get into power to get the extra monies that come from being in power through 'wages'.
... And they always agree on pay rises for themselves.

Czuch: Which government? The one the President controls.. or the one he doesn't?

ScarletRose: It's the same problem over here, thanks to a period when house prices and the selling rules were abused, house prices increased to the point where your average hard working Joe can't afford a decent house, or has taken out a stupid mortgage which is now leaving many in the state where their house could be repossessed. And thanks to negative equity through house prices dropping, they are looking at still being burden by a big debt.

That's why the call for more social housing over here is so big. It would have been sorted some years back but dear ol' Maggie Thatchers government stopped councils from reinvesting money gained from the selling of council properties to long term tenants from being put into building schemes.

Yet, one good thing is now there is a scheme in social housing where people can part rent and part buy their properties. Giving them a reasonable start into the housing system without the high mortgages.

Vikings: And no-one thought to question such a policy on both sides of the political spectrum??? That's what gets me. If all your govs since Carter had been Democrats then I could see a point, but no-one on the Republican side either saw or challenged the 'rules' when in power.

... Strange

But there again, I've seen on this side of the Atlantic the same happen. One side says 'X' is a bad idea but when the get into power they don't change it!!

... Strange world we have.

Czuch: It's not a bump. We are looking at the possibility of a worldwide recession... The IMF is predicting global growth to fall below zero this year.

As a dude there says "...the worst performance in most of our lifetimes..."

ScarletRose: Plastic sucks. It's best to stick to a debit card.

The mask is from the film "V for Vendetta"... It's worth a watch if you can, it's plot is based on what would happen if a government became a law onto itself and the leader of it is a fascist dictator hiding behind the church.

ScarletRose: Shhhhhh Don't say the word "scary"... If a certain glob was still here, he'd have you banned!!

But the fraud is no more.

Vikings: So who started this 'rule' and why was it not spotted that it wasn't working and corrected? And that ACORN is a community program oriented program... How come the banks couldn't just prove their case that bad loans are bad loans?

"The banking industry made a practice of talking people into buying homes they couldn’t afford." I read because of ACORN... I don't get how a bank can be forced into making a bad loan. I'd fight anyone if I was in charge of a bank against such 'rules'.

I goto my MP, my Government, my Prime Minister... I'd go on TV, interviews for paper and radio....

But over here, it was the banks fault. And not all problems in America are due 'rules'... $50 billion dollar frauds don't help.

ScarletRose: NO!!

Vikings: Nope, I disagree on that. Seeing as we've had alot of incidents over here regarding banks, and some inquiries have been made.. and some whistle blowers have blown.

Much of the banks mess is due to their greed and recklessness. Eg.. one of the banks we've had to save over here was due to it ignoring warnings from it's own risk assessment team..... they even bought a bank (or part of) without having a full accounts statement from them.

As for government corruption... that's why need revolution, and in some form it is happening... at least over here thanks to the freedom of information act.

Btw.. one building company went broke yesterday... didn't help that they bought a ruby worth over 10 million pounds just two years ago... No news over if they will sell it to bail out the company, seeing as the business is only short £2 million (approx) technically looking at it is owed £2 million from work done.

... I see AIG executives are being the usual fat cat ...... I can't say the word here.

Hopefully Your Pres will learn from the UK and find the contractual minimum or take the company to task over the bonuses that the .. ...... ... want to pay themselves out of your taxes.

As our PM and Gov say.. why should failure be rewarded?

Artful Dodger: Over here we get two bins supplied by our council, one for un-recyclable stuff (green), and one for recyclable items (blue)... Except for glass. That our point of recycling is less then 5 minutes away.

... We never chuck away stuff that could have a second life, or have items from within that are capable of being used for a repair job on an item. The number of assorted screws and fixings I've kept back from deconstructing ietms no longer suitable for our home fills a large plastic box.

We have a recycle point for clothes at the glass recycling point (as well as paper), for the third world needy. Charity shops always get our non-needed good stuff... Clothes, toys, etc. I gave them a router last week as since we changed our ISP the new modem comes with wi-fi bulit in.

The Usurper: I don't think it's purely the leaders fault. I feel it's more the business sector, in particular 'weapons' manufacturers that are calling the shots.

..... Shame. As if just a few % of the money spent on weapons worldwide was transferred to social priorities then much of the worlds ills would have the money to be sorted.

... Maybe a tax on weapons manufacturers directly going towards nice causes.

Artful Dodger: Then we should behave like that... I mean, in an age of 'recycling' I see more and more products aimed at us that are single use only. They cost more and generate more waste. And practically we've been been able to do the jobs without these products for generations.

All for a profit!!

Artful Dodger: Certain people having been saying about our children and how we are just borrowing this planet off them for years, decades and even century's.... When the American Indians were asked to sell their land.. they said how can we sell what we don't own!!

As said by one chief in 1854... us 'westerners' just seem to understand the concept that we don't own this planet.

The Usurper: Or.......

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=To0_jqz_YGk

The Usurper: I think the only reason it has not been legalised is due to the drinks industry. As for harmfulness... they did a recent report and it came pretty low... Baccy and booze were at the top of lethality almost.

As you say.. it is all right for groups like the 'CIA' to deal in drugs when it suits them for 'political' reasons, but as one old gran over here said "Why should I be prosecuted for growing my own plant and then eat it? The drugs they had me on from the doctors made me feel sick with other side effects, someone suggested eating a little bit and it works!! No side effects, no feeling sick."

It's a plant.. the only thing scientific evidence shows is that for growth reasons (mentally and emotionally) .... an age limit would need to be set. But seeing as it's already illegal for under 18's here to drink and smoke... but a kid at home can under adult supervision have a weeee dram.

As one scientist said who works for Her Maj's Gov growing tons of marijuana plants a year (in a top secret location) "If they made it legal, but regulated and subject to tax, standards on produce active ingredients (like tar and nicotine)... medically we know it can be of use (I believe your California has 'pot' doctors) .. so why not do it right? I mean, I'm growing a 50/50 THC to CBD cloned plant. My standards are very high as I work for the government.

It's again.. like with anything, people abusing it (same as baccy and booze) that causes problems. But then again, they prescribe morphine products over here which by nature will require a withdrawal procedure if the patient comes off them in the future, they prescribe drugs with side effects that can be real nasty..

Strange world....

The Usurper: Reminds me of Horizon... a prog over here. All these years people have been going on about THC and forgetting about CBD.... Who knows .. they might make a pill version of CBD!! :)

ScarletRose: Better to do it several times. In through the nose and out through the mouth.... and using the diaphragm not the chest.

The Usurper: I see Judaism keeps up with modern tech and knowledge of the universe and has no problem with it.... and technically the man Jesus was a Jew, as he was also Christ. In Greece, it became a philosophy.. the unmoved mover, expansions on the Great I AM... but they added Hades.... Mmmmmm
The Romans in a quest for a new empire turned it into a religion, yet there were those who still carried on thinking, feeling and knowing God.. eg the Desert Fathers.

A long way... who knows how long ;) step by step, layer by layer.

The main thing is just to keep at it.

The Usurper: I'm not turned off, I just have a natural scepticism for someone who drives around in a limo wearing expensive clothing (that was supposed to go on the cause to defeat the devil!!) and says they represent God.

As for Spirit... it's all aRoUnD us. It's a shame when people rather go around damning people in the name of Christ, rather then just stop, slow down the mind and listen, feel, hear ;)

The Usurper: Doctored..... yes in the respect that much was left out to 'compile' the Bible... Changed... Yep, but in the matter of interpretation.

.... Yet, if one really studies and goes back to the roots, to the early days before the 'Bible' was formed as a step to organise Christianity, there is much to see.

Quite frankly, in America religion has become too much of a business. Some 'preachers' live to good a life I feel, liking the money rather then true saving.

Maybe they should try the Eastern style... They own nothing and the community provides their alms.

Bwild: Or.... " a people should not be afraid of it's government, the government should be afraid of it's people."

Bwild: Because some things never change, or slowly. We've still not beaten the corruption problem within our governments, hence the quote.

... It's just an example.

Likewise.. Another quote. "Democracy is not perfect, but it's the best system of government so far."

Czuch: Nope.. you don't. But you need to be able to touch your spiritual side through whichever system or way you find good for you.

Zen is good, Buddhism also

If you are saying that there are those within religions who really have not studied the depth of religion and use it to justify their 'idols' rather then use it as a way to get to 'know' God.... not just to believe in God... but 'know'.

I agree. Yet that is not all religious people. Even pure atheists cannot not deny spiritual moments, as I have read from one pure atheist.

The Usurper: Figures.. I hear one guy had to resign his post in intelligence because he criticised Israel about the Palestinian situation.

I think he upset some Israeli supporters in America. awwwwwwwwww

Bwild: Don't fit..... a crutch

Most of the ideas if applied with an empty cup rather then a full one do work. You see the text was written with many levels of revelation built in.

.... And I use the Bible as well as other good religious texts (eg from Zen, Hinduism, Judaism and even some old Egyptian texts. Good knowledge and wisdom never loses it's power or usability.

Czuch: When we have to feed them it's usually because of a dictator or war.. agreed. Many of these affected people have been after help in terms of someone to step in and bring order, but their cries have been ignored. By us westerners or their own local countries.

Some of the problems relate back to our loan system we use to have with many third world countries, some of the problems were from us trying to make them live like westerners, rather then live with the land and use it properly.

There is a lot to fix and it's not an overnight fix job.

Czuch: Then why are you bugged by the charities helping them become self reliant so we don't have to feed them?

Bwild: And in the end the mother gave up the baby rather then see it harmed. A good way to see who the mother is as she would never allow harm to come to her child.

King Solomon said, "Bring me a sword!" So they brought a sword before the King. The King said, "Cut the living child in two, and give half to one and half to the other"

The woman (#2) turned to the King, because her compassion was aroused for her son, and said: "Please my Lord, give her the living child and do not kill it!"

But the other woman (#1) said: "Neither mine nor yours shall he be. Cut!"

The King spoke up and said: "Give her (#2) the living child, and do not kill it, for she is his mother!" All of Israel heard the judgment that the King had judged. They had great awe for the King, for they saw that the wisdom of God was within him to do justice. [I Melachim 3:16 - 27]. The woman was rightfully awarded custody of her son.

Czuch: Czuch.. many mistakes were made in the past that have affected their quality of life. Many of those mistakes were made by the western world.

It bugs you that people are working to reverse those mistakes and to make these people self reliant?

There are also many newish orgs giving back by buying these countries produce at a fair price, and/or helping them establish a better standard of living. Eg "Fairtrade" and "Rainforest Alliance".

For many years these people have been exploited by companies by paying low rates for their produce. That is really starting to stop. At least over here it is.

Bwild: They say because of things in the text and of records dating back to the era that it was written. King Solomon was well known for his wisdom and Israel reached it's pinnacle under his rule.

1 Kings 4:34 (NIV)
34 Men of all nations came to listen to Solomon’s wisdom, sent by all the kings of the world, who had heard of his wisdom.

Proverbs is said to be "the greatest "how-to" book ever written".