Whatever country you live in, healthcare cannot be a right because it relies on the skills of other people. The system in the US (pre Obama) is by far the best. It is a choice of whether or not you pay.

"Health insurance is a product, not a right. The right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness means the right to being free to pursue those things"



if you take the insurance out of it, it sounds like health is a product and not a right... at least when it comes to preventive medicine. It also seems that it's ok for someone to lose everything they have worked for just to pay for the medical care they need to obtain relief from illnesses that cause their '''happiness''' to be a past memory.

Hey.. that doc there!! Does he need a new 50 foot pool? Isn't 30 foot big enough!!

Artful Dodger: Never occured to me that Roberts would vote to uphold it. Some people speculated about what Justice Kennedy might do, after he said it would forever change the governments relationship with the people.

Health insurance is a product, not a right. The right to life liberty and the pursuit of happiness means the right to being free to pursue those things. It doesn't mean it's the governments responsibility to make it so, it means the government should step back and let us pursue those things for ourselves.

The idea of being ruled over by a nanny state type of government is so obnoxious, it's difficult for me to comment on it without using salty language and disturbing visual imagery.

Iamon lyme: The Supreme Court messed up. The ObamaCare package was being sold as legitimate due to the Commerce Clause. But CJ Roberts said no, it's a tax and therefore it stands.

He should have sent it back to the congress and said, "OK, now you fix this and pass it as the tax it is and it's legit. But as it stands it's not."

The Dums...I mean Dems would NEVER pass it as a tax. They are on record as saying they would not pass it as a tax. That's why they trumped it under the Commerce Clause.

OBAMA is a Big Fat Liar.

Iamon lyme: Yeah, not even liberal New York would do something that stupid. I mean, some libs are morons but not to that extent!

Artful Dodger: "You don't have to buy insurance if you don't want. But you'll still have to pay for it via the tax."

It's a tax? Obama said it wasn't a tax, but I don't think he consulted the dictionary when he made that statement. Fred Thompson has assured us that "We won't be taking water from your side of the bucket. We will take it from the other side." He was talking about something else but it still applies here, doesn't it?

rod03801: "Next is : We will be told what we can and can't eat."

Or what size sody pops we may purchase...

Naw, it'll never happen.

Iamon lyme: You don't have to buy insurance if you don't want. But you'll still have to pay for it via the tax.

Iamon lyme: Next is : We will be told what we can and can't eat.

What's next? Mandatory term life insurance? What else could we be forced to pay for?

I know! State controled gasoline insurance! We have a right to affordable gas. We don't have a right to get our own oil, but that's a separate issue... that has nothing to do with gas prices.

Iamon lyme: Greed.

Iamon lyme: All our troubles can be traced right back to the government.

(V): "I hear a class action is forming in the USA based on what the banks have done. Can't blame this on the government.."

It was aliens who pressured the banks into making risky loans, not the government... and who controls the aliens?

Artful Dodger: In every picture I've seen of Holder he looks so sad and put upon. I almost feel sorry for the guy.. but I think that was the point of showing him look like that.

Iamon lyme: congress is now voting / debating on holder in contempt

Mz Pelosi accused Republicans of wanting to "suppress voter turnout" by trying to get Eric Holder to talk. Pelosi can rest easy now, because todays SCOTUS ruling should put concerns of voter turnout to rest.

I can't imagine the next Nov election being a repeat of the Reagan/Carter blowout, but I'll be hedging my bets on that one too. I may as well throw it all into the pot and go for broke... what have I got to lose?

rod03801: Murdoch is not fascinating.. just how politicians are continually kissing upto him regarding getting good press.

It's is perceivable that Fox could switch to backing the Democrats if Murdoch got a better deal from them!!

I don't how much it's being 'told' in the USA, but the big news financially here is regarding the banks AGAIN!!

But it looks like many of the big banks have been rigging rates.

Barclays has been fined £290 million, other banks are by all accounts will be taken to court.

I hear a class action is forming in the USA based on what the banks have done.

Can't blame this on the government..

Bwild: What about those incarcerated?

Artful Dodger: "...what's the SCOTUS going to rule on Obama Care tomorrow?"

It's hard to say. I'm hoping they look to the constitution to determine if any of it is constitutional or not. Some Washington insiders are of the opinion that the constitutionality of Obama care is what the judges should be looking at. Last time I looked that actually was a part of their job description, or is their job description... I'm a bit fuzzy on the details. *cough*

Obama is either going to gloat, or make a big stink over it, that's what I predict... I'm hedging my bets.

Artful Dodger: only 2 states in the nation deny felons the right to vote.

rod03801: The democrats like it that way. They have dead people voting all over the US. Not to mention the many voters they have that are ineligible for one reason or another (illegal, under age, double and triple voting, etc)

Artful Dodger: I was SHOCKED the first time I ever voted. I had my ID ready, and the lady said, "oh we can't ask for that". I was like.. WHAT??!! One of the most important things we do, and we don't have to prove who we are?

Bernice: Oh, religion and politics are bedfellows (sadly).

The Col: thought you might like that one

Artful Dodger:

thanks, I needed a good laugh

And what's the big deal libs make over voter ID. If a white person can get a voter ID, can't a black/hispanic/whatever? The ONE big thing that affects voter ID is it will stop dead people from voting AND felons AND people no eligible to vote. hmmmmmm

rod03801: BTW, I couldn't care less what Murdock does. His actions are no reflection on Fox News and try as some might to make that connection, it's a major #fail.

rod03801:

OK, so what's the SCOTUS going to rule on Obama Care tomorrow?

I would have to agree that parts of this discussion are FAR from the intentions of this board. I was hoping it was just an "aside" and would end on its own.

So, please. Let's get off of Brainking Politics. Though it got more attention than the fascinating Rupert Murdoch.

I appeal to the Mods... please, can you get this board back to politics rather than site politics.

Thank you.

Iamon lyme: exactly. The fact that you and I agree on so many political positions seems to have gotten a bit more attention than the arguments themselves. I was once accused of being a particular member here simply because I used the same smiley in some (mark that SOME) of my posts. She's black and can't stand me. And according to a few, that was just a ruse on my part to deceive. Such nonsense serves only as a distraction. As as we both know, liberals LOVE a distraction. Especially true when it comes to deflecting criticisms against their bad policies.

Iamon lyme: Does it.. I thought all this talk about what people may or not think about who is who as being one big distraction. Nothing is being proved or disproved by it at all.

"Jiggering numbers for the sake of creating a false consensus is nothing new in world of politics, is it?"

The creation of false nicks is a long established '''way''' on this site. It could be said that many of those involved in 'politics' have created fake accounts, or used others for the sake of satisfying their need, just as in the real world.

Usually one side moans about the other even though they may be, may have been, or know someone who has done the same.

(V): "btw.. is all this "I'm not you" really necessary? Hardly politics is it."

Sure it is. Didn't you know? Combining two opponents into one serves two purposes, it serves to distract from the issues and it makes it appear there is one less opponent. And if the side making the accusation is creating false nics and getting away with it, they can make it appear there are more of them. Jiggering numbers for the sake of creating a false consensus is nothing new in world of politics, is it?

btw.. is all this "I'm not you" really necessary?

Hardly politics is it.

Iamon lyme: Ok.. some history.. over the last 60 years..ish

We've seen various western and eastern states play a game of NIMBY.

....that's Not In My Back Yard.

Gun running, drugs, the support of terrorists, murderers n' genocidal maniacs. Chemically induced abnormalities in babies, stillbirths, leukaemia, etc, etc, etc..

Billions of dollars/pounds/euros given to those who are known by those supplying the money to have only one purpose with it... to kill. That women and children are killed in the process is not of the playing powers concern.

Because it's a NIMBY event. It didn't happen in their backyard, it wasn't millions of their own people...... they were 'foreigners' or 'third world' countries who needed help in deciding how to be democratic or free of capitalists.

The death and maiming toll from such policies hasn't stopped growing.

.... so......... when I see yet another case of guns getting into unfriendly hands (like all those that vanished in Iraq) .... I'm not surprised or shocked. It's like when the press went mad at Angelina Jolie showing a leg.. going "WOW.. how sexy and daring

... bull, get a reality check. It's been done before and much better by the likes of Marilyn Monroe.

Great, Lemon Lime just left and now I am here talking to myself. Wait a sec, I was doing that when he was online too!

Iamon lyme: I'm actually off to bed. Actually, I'm not really even here. Just because you're reading this post that proves nothing except that in your mind your reading something.

Iamon lyme: My psychiatrist said I don't have multiple personality disorder but we know better.

Artful Dodger: I should be sleeping now too, but haven't had much sleep since last Thursday.. the day I emerged from your sub-consious mind and reasserted my identity.

You know what, maybe "they" are right, maybe we just don't know it. If you had a split personality, but neither you nor your other identity (me) was aware of the other one, and wouldn't even know about the other one except we just happened to meet online, and are unaware that we are both talking to the other personality, in the same body.. That kind of trailed off, didn't it? What was my point?

I want to be open minded about this, and as (V) said, how can we really be sure if something is true or not?

Iamon lyme: I love the way the liberals LOVE to play the race card. So pathetic.

Artful Dodger: Oh, there you are. I don't mean the English feller, I mean.. Oh, there I am!

Iamon lyme: He sleeping for now.

Yup. Tumbleweeds and duststorms. And nowhere to float my boat. Where that Engish feller scoot off to?

Iamon lyme: I know. I guess the proponents believe that if they change the name it gives their fraud more credibility.

Artful Dodger: I think it's now officially called Climate Change... the greedy capitalists cashing in on this scam are covering their butts. If it all goes south they can claim "Hey, the climate changes all the time! Yesterday it rained, but today it's just cloudy. Tomorrow it's supposed to be sunny and warm. See? We weren't lying about anything."

"By the way, want to buy a few carbon credits? They are going for rock bottom prices. Business has been slow, so we have a huge back log of them. We need to move them out to make room for more. Prices have never been this low, but this offer won't last long. So act now and put in your order today, before we go to prison for ripping you off."

Iamon lyme: Suppress voter turnout? Is that what Republicans are trying to do? I don't think so.

They couldn't suppress voter turnout if they wanted to. With so many people out of work, and more on the way to being out of work, does Mz Pelosi really think no one is motivated to start seeing some kind of POSITIVE change?

For those of you who don't have a problem with supplying Mexican drug lords with weapons...

"Democrats argue that Issa and his GOP colleagues are using the issue to try to score political points by discrediting Holder and, by extension, the president in an election year."

"House Democratic leader Nancy Pelosi, D-California, alleged last week that Republicans were targeting Holder because he is fighting their efforts to suppress voter turnout in November."

What if those weapons had instead fallen into the hands of our allies, Mz Pelosi? Would you still try sweeping it under the rug?

Senior Editor for the New York Incontinent Times reports that readership in his paper has increased over the past 6 months. Iamon lyme, whose national origin has been questioned because of his funny sounding name, said "People appreciate a fair and ballanced approach to the news. They also appreciate the fact that the paper we use is both soft and durable."