Does anyone know whether BK has any plans to implement Pool Checkers?

HardyBoy: Ups, it's a czech checkers game ehehe. I was absent-minded...lolol

I'm playing portuguese checkers and in this game Damas Checas (HardyBoy vs. orhion) I should can choose between capture 2 pieces (pawns) with my queen or pawn. However, I only can select my queen. It's impossible select pawn to make the capture. In this situation, I only was obliged to capture with my queen if I was playing czech checkers.
Fortunately, this situation is indifferent to result of my game, but can happen the same in others games. Be careful. I'm going to send a message to Fencer.

Fencer: Yes, you are right. I don't know why I missed that.

AbigailII: "A queen can make long jumps (over more empty squares) but must land just on the next square after the captured piece." - I think it's clear enough, isn't it?
It's an excerpt from the full rules.

Since BK has expanded its offerings of Draughts, it would be nice if it offered Pool Checkers, too. It is a great game.

The short rules of Thai checkers mention that a capturing queen has to land on the square directly behind the captured stone. But this rule is not mentioned in the full rules.

Gabriel Almeida:
Mistake it is corrected...........    http://dama.yenisesler.net/

Gabriel Almeida: eheh

Gabriel Almeida:I not the owner of it  http://dama.yenisesler.net/ a site but a sign
with the owner of a site.......... I on пращу it to correct this
mistake............

Andre Faria: By the way... I know what's a king, but... what's a KIG? I hope I'm not saying any bad word, as my english is so poor! ;)

me either...

joshi tm: I vonted in BrainKIG too... ;)

joshi tm:
Thanks...........

Tutagil: Done. But, BrainKing is spelled wrong on that site :D

   On http://dama.yenisesler.net/ a site it is spent questionnaires with a question: On what site the best it is possible to play Turkish checkers? I ask all to vote for our fine Brain King.

On March, 4th the game rule Turkish checkers at has come change and the given rules on 100 % corresponds with the present game rules. I want on behalf of all fans of game of Turkish checkers on thanks the Fencer for this fine work.............

Fencer: Good morning! I just woke up myself. We do indeed live in different time zones.

I'll see what I can do, post it back here in a few days, and send you a copy too. It may not shrink in size much since so much of the game is completely different than regular Checkers. I can just list the differences and that should be a lot smaller, though that might not tell one how to play the game. I suppose it will make it easier for a regular Checker player to know what's coming and be ready by the second game.

Walter Montego: It's too long to read just after waking up. Could you post a short list of differences, compared to normal Checkers?

coan.net: I posted how to play Jump Checkers right on this discussion board eleven posts back on December 8th, 2007
Checkers variants (8x8) (Walter Montego, 2007-12-09 01:42:49)
and some pointers on how to play right after that post. It's an obscure game that I'm sure would not make any lists as you suggest. It first needs to have a few people play it and see if they like it or not. I think just from that post one could program Jump Checkers for this site. IF Fencer has any questions about the play, I'll be happy to answer them.

Hi,

Whoever wants to play a quick game of Checkers, just send me an invite to play.

1 day/standard vacation are the settings I can handle ;)

coan.net: As for an easy variant to add, if Draughts ("International Checkers") is created, is Canadian checkers. It has the same rules as Draughts, except that's it's played on a 12x12 board (with 30 checkers).

Wikipedia has a handy table which lists the differences between the regional draughts/checkers variants, and has links to some "invented" variants.

Walter Montego: International checkers is the standard checkers game played in the Netherlands and Russia.

Walter Montego: You should check out the http://brainking.com/en/Board?bc=3 board.

Fencer has been asking for a couple of questions about the rules of international checkers.... which most likely means he is working on programming it. (not a guarentee - but why else would he be asking about the rules)

My suggestion - list the top 2 or 3 checker variants that you think would attract the most players - and post detailed rules about each of them here. Hopefully if Fencer is still in a programming mood, he will take up adding a few more checker variants. (and as he is programming 1 checker variant - it is usually easier to program other checker variants)

Two months have gone by since I posted about Jump Checkers and you about International Checkers. Neither game is avaiable here as of yet, but a slew of other games are. Obscure games I might add, plus some that were just made up and put into play right here because Fencer or someone else wanted to play them. I think Jump Checkers would be a great addition to the site. It'd certainly help its reputation as a player's and inventor's place to play. I don't know International Checkers, but you make it sound as if it is a widely played game, so I'm kind of puzzled why it isn't on here too.

Please try to get ANYTHING in checkers through in Fencer's mind, for you know Fencer hates Checkers. Any new variant, of course I appreciate for the International Checkers.

Good luck!

Gabriel Almeida: Why not have those games and Jump Checkers? Those games you mention are all just slight variations of the same game. Yes, that makes them different games, but not as much as the differences between Atomic, Extinction, Embassy, Loop, Dark, or Giveaway Chess variants. As for Jump Checkers, it truly is a different kind of Checkers. Play a couple of games and see for yourself.

You got me curious about the Checkers games that are on this site. That's a rather strange and incomplete list, I will agree with you there! It looks rather skewed towards Czech versions too, which I assume is the flying Queen/King rules. This might have something to do with where Fencer is from?

Just regular ol' Checkers has a few variants in the playing rules that I'm sure aren't available as choices here, either. I never play Checkers, but it is a challenging game. I sure wouldn't play the game online as it can now be played perfectly by machines and computer programs. Is there a Dark Checkers version? Would it be or is it as playable as Dark Chess is?

I'm still rooting for Jump Checkers. Maybe Fencer will never add it, but at least he knows of the game, and now you do too. He's added other obscure games here and I've seen him add games that were made up on the fly, like how Ambiguous Chess was added to the site. Jump Checkers may not be widely known or even played any more, but it isn't just some game out of the blue. Well, yes I guess it is! :) And if it does get added, I'll play it. And you'll get an invitation too.

Walter Montego: Hi, Montego. INstead of a "jump checkers", I would rather see in brainking some important variants, played all over the world, with true championships, like Russian checkers, classic checkers, Italian checkers or International checkers. In my opinion, those should be "checkers priorities" here. But it doesn't mean I disagree with the introdution of jump checkers, of course. Just a question of priority!

Yeah, that was rather underwhelming, but I suppose I'll go ahead and post the rest just in the case a Checker Variant enthusiast might give the game a try and have some questions about the play.
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A King is a lot stronger than a Man. A Man just has two movement places compared to a King's six. A Man can be blocked just by putting any piece in front of it though such a blocked Man can jump over the blocking piece if it can make a capture or split jump. A Man can only capture by jumping over any piece first, whereas a King can capture simply by moving sideways or jumping over any piece forwards or backwards and landing on an opponent's piece and a King can capture a King straight across too. A King early in the game can clear out the opponet's backrows very quickly by capturing moving sideways, so you have to prevent your opponent from getting a King unless you are able to get one yourself. A split jump can fight off a King as it can be split apart moving one of the Men sideways. This can keep a King away from the split jump or force the King next to the split jump and then to jump over the split jump to get past it safely.
The Men can make split jumps and this can be a powerful set up. As the split jump is moved apart you can relay the Man forward and get behind the opponent's defense. A split jump is vulnerable to attack right next to it though and a good threat is to immediately jump one of your Men towards the split jump setting up the capture of the split jump on the next turn, thereby forcing your opponent to play out the split jump instead of letting him keep it there threatening you.
When the game is nearing the all Kings stage you have to be carefull because when the last Man is off the board the Kings get the extra capturing move and this can be a lot of trouble if you haven't prepared for it.
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More added=====>
Walter Montego: (1. November 2007, 00:04:12) No, a piece may jump over any piece to make a capture. The piece that is jumped over remains where it is.
Kings can jump any piece and do not have to make a capture unless the jumping lands on a piece. Nothing happens if a Kings jumps a piece and lands on an unoccupied square.
Men can only jump an opponent's piece if they make a capture or a split jump. Men MAY NOT jump an opponent's piece and land on an unoccupied square. Men can always jump over their own side's piece (King or Man) and land on an unoccupied square.

A split jump is a special move. Only the Men can make it, never a King or Kings. To do a split jump a Man must jump ANY piece of EITHER player and land on a Man of HIS side. The two Men occupy the square together. Yes, there's usually not room enough to accomodate them so you might lean one on the other or you can just have them side by side in the square overlapping into the unused colored squares, just don't stack them on top of each other as it'll look like a King and that is not what it is. If you're playing in a noisy enviroment or with someone that's not paying too close of attention to the game for some reason, you might also point out to your opponent that you just made a split jump. This can help prevent confusion or an argument from developing.

I'm not sure if I'm clear on the jumping. All jumps in Jump Checkers cover the same distance. The piece that's going to do the jumping must be right next to the piece that's going to be jumped. When the jump is complete, the piece that did the jumping is on the square immediately on the other side of the jumped piece. That's it. No roaming or flying Queens. It looks like a jump in regular Checkers except that the piece that is jumped over is never captured.

Men can capture in two ways. (1) By jumping ANY piece and landing on the opponent's piece in the immediate square after the jumped piece. (2) By moving off of a split jump. When one of the two Men that occupy a square in a split jump is moved it must go to one of three squares. Orthogonally sideways or forward straight across. If an opponent's piece occupies the square, it is captured.
Kings capture in four ways. (1) They can jump any piece and land on an opponent's piece. (2) They can move orthogonally sideways and if the square is occupied by an opponent's piece, the piece is captured. (3) If an opponent's King is orthogonally straight ahead or behind the King, the King may move to capture the opponent's King by occupying that King's square. (4) At the stage of the game when the only pieces on the board are all Kings, a King may capture an opponent's King by moving diagonally two squares. (This move looks like a jump and landing on a King without a piece being jumped)

Captures are optional. No double jumps. In Jump Checkers you have to guard your pieces similar to how it is done in Chess. Trades are like that too. The not having to make a capture rule is one thing that makes Jump Checkers a lot different than most Checkers variants. Having two Men on one square is different too. And no double jumps is another. Kings are a lot stronger than Men, so make sure you don't let your opponent get a King unless you can get one yourself or have a defensive line that the King can't break up or else that King will eat up all your pieces in a few moves and the game will be over. When you have two Men in a split jump, you can control the three squares that one of the Men must move to when the split jump is broken up. A King can't easily fight against a split jump unless he can position a piece to jump onto the split jump. As I said earlier, one way to fight split jumps is to immediately jump a piece towards the square with the split jump's two Men on it. This threatens to capture the two Men in the split jump and it attacks it from the diagonal. The split jump Man leaves orthogonally. It'll take a few games of play to see how to use split jumps to your advantage and also how to thwart them. Though this may seem obvious, you should never make a split jump that is subject to immediate capture! You'll lose two Men and I can't imagine a position where that would be a favorable outcome.

I'm assuming your search for Jump Checkers came up empty?

Kevin Hill in 1975 made this game up while him and Steve Owens were having a discussion about how to play Checkers. I used to play it a lot back then, but it more or less died out. Talking with Bepop on this site got me to remembering the game. Like Kevin's Embassy Chess, he hasn't gotten around to setting up a web page or site about the game. He says it'll happen soon. I saved some of the conversation with Bepop and will post it in a day or so if there's any questions about the play if someone wants to give Jump Checkers a play or two.
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Jump Checkers is set up like regular checkers on an 8 × 8 board. The play of the game is only on the 32 dark colored squares. There's two kinds of pieces in the game, Men and Kings. So far it's like regular Checkers, eh? Jump Checkers is won in the same manner as regular Checkers; the player that moves last wins the game.

The Men move one square diagonally forward. They may also jump over one of their own Men or Kings and land on the unoccupied square directly afterward (Chinese Checkers style). The Men may not jump the opponent's Men or Kings unless they are making a capture or split jump. A capture by a Man is made by jumping over ANY piece and landing on the square directly after the jumped piece that is occupied by the opponent. The enemy piece is removed from the board. There are no double jumps and capturing is not mandatory. Strictly optional.
A split jump is similar to a capture, except that the Man lands in a square already occupied by a Man of his side. When this happens, both Men occupy the square together. They are not put together into a King, but remain two separate Men. When one of the Men in a split jump is moved his place to be moved to is one of three squares. Either directly across orthogonally or to one of the orthogonally side squares. If the square is occupied by the opponent, it is captured. The Man left behind in a split jump is just a regular Man again and moves like he did before becoming a part of the split jump. If the opponent can move to a square occupied by two Men in a split jump, he captures them both if he chooses to move there. Kings may not be a part of a split jump, only the Men. If a split jump Man is moved to a square held by the player with a Man, it is a split jump and the two Men are as usual in a split jump.
When a Man reaches the last row of the board he is promoted to a King. This is done in the usual way by placing a Checker on top and crowning him. A King can move like a Man and also has extra movement and capturing abilities. A King may move one square diagonally in any direction. A King may move sideways orthogonally to the next square that's part of the board. If a King moves sideways to such a square and it has an opponent's piece or split jump there, it is captured. A King may move straight across forwards or backwards orthogonally only to capture an opponent's King. A King cannot make this move to capture an opponent's Man or an opponent's split jump, only a King, and a King may not make this move without capturing. A King may jump any piece and land on the square directly afterwards without making a capture. If a game becomes a game where all the pieces on the board are Kings, a King gets one more capturing ability. When it is all Kings, a King may capture another King that is two squares away diagonally. (Think of it as if the King had jumped a piece and landed on the King)

That's the rules. :) It's simple enough, but it plays a lot differently than regular Checkers. It can get complicated too.

Walter Montego: How about posting a URL to the rules of the game?

This is a good variant. Any chance of getting it added to the site? I can post a general how to play if anyone is interested right here.

even if the rules makes sense, I thought it was different before. However, by looking at my previous games, I cannot find a counter example, so I must be mistaking. Thanks

The rule: "If, after jumping, it is possible to jump over another opponent's piece, the player must capture this piece too"

That rule has always been like that - and I always try to make "traps" that will take advantage of that rule when I can.

mangue: No, I think you're confused.
In this situation, you're forced to take 2 pawns. These are the rules. You could only choose if you had other queen in E5, for example. So, you could take E5 to G7 or E5 to A1 or F8 to F2. But if you only have one possible capture, so you have to take all possible pieces.
Do you understand?

Parachute Checkers (mangue vs. joshi tm)
after 11th move of black.
Why am I forced to take 2 pawns with my Queen?
I cannot play f8-a3 and I do not understand why. Did the rule changed?

Greg Murray: I must tell you I ABSOLUTELLY agree with your position. I think the same, and that was the reason why I also haven't renew my membership. I'm playing more in Ludoteka, but I Goldtoken it's also a great site, where checkers are taked more seriously!

Paying members shouldn't be trying to 'get an audience' with the silent, inscrutible leader of this website. It should be the other way around! He should be reaching out to us. We shouldn't be trying to write nice PMs, say things in just the right way, 'hope' he'll condescend to respond to us....

I for one believe fencer is terribly discourteous and all the site features in the world won't change that. For that reason I will not be renewing my membership here...I have joined GoldToken and find things more pleasant and the checkers more involved and serious. And, most important, the management on GT actually appreciates the paid membership....

Greg

!Undertaker!: Exactly!
Maybe we should PM him just linking this board! ;)
I'll do that!

nodnarbo: "Just be sure not to expect an imediate response"? ahahah. Of course, I know that. There're one year and some months ago, I sent a message to Fencer, asking when he would go to introduce classic checkers in BK. His answer was: In soon. Do you see classic checkers here?
Ah, and if I or you or other people talk about checkers on a public board like BrainKing.com or Feature requests, he despises that comment. It's simple.

coan.net: Thanks coan.net. I didn't know this site. It's very interesting with good games.

nodnarbo: That is exactly what I was going to say....besides being a public board, Fencer doesnt like grievances aired publicly. Write him a PM and you might have more luck in getting a reply.

Everyone: Just so you are all aware, writing on the checkers board won't change anything. Fencer does not read this board! If you would like to write so that the management listens this is not the place to do it. Either write on a public board that Fencer reads more (such as the Feature requests board) or message him directly. Just be sure not to expect an imediate response.

!Undertaker!: I agree with you. Although I mainly play other games, the fact that things like this are ignored here at BK makes this site a much poorer site than is should be. View my profile for my thoughts on this. I did not renew my paid membership when it ran out many months ago and I will probably leave when I finish the few tournaments I am still active in.

!Undertaker!: I'm not a big Checkers player or anything, but wanted to mention http://www.goldtoken.com as a possible site.

GoldToken has recently been choosen to become the official playing site of the American Checker Federation (ACF). So GT has been working hard making sure all rules are correct and everything - and has been adding checker variants. (Plus GT is the official game site for the New Zealand Draughts Association (NZDA) also)

But they have:

* Checkers
* Armenian Checkers
* 11 Man Ballot
* Brazilian Checkers
* Canadian Checkers
* Czech Checkers
8 Man
* Frisian Checkers
* Giveaway Checkers
* International Checkers
* Italian Checkers
* Pool Checkers
* Restriction Checkers
* Russian Checkers
* Spanish Checkers
* Turkish Checkers

I'm not sure how many of you have tried out that site, but it sounds like they are trying hard to bring their Checker games up to par - so it might be a place for Checker fans to check out.

!Undertaker!: Well, Undertaker... you said the name! ;)
I think this is the point! Noone who really likes checkers can understand Fencer's options in this kind of games. And that's why we - checkers players of brainking - are playing in Ludoteka. There, we REALLY can play checkers. That's it...

CryingLoser: More patient? For what? Fencer priorities are very strange. Portuguese people tried introduce classic checkers in BK, we did a petition, I wrote an article in Brainrook and until now, nothing. I think Francesco LaRocca requested him to introduce Italian checkers, Ustica requested to introduce pool checkers, and many people already request him to introduce international and Russian checkers. These are the variants more played in the world (classic, international and Russian checkers). What did Fencer do? He introduced Hawaiian checkers, a stupid game, played in small islands in Pacific North. This is a joke? Who many people requested him this game? Is Hawaiian checkers priority? But wait, there’re more incredible games like one way checkers or parachutes checkers. In one way checkers, the white player has clear advantage. Is it an interesting game? Is this priority? Not, for me.
So, because of that reasons, when I’m finished my games here, I’ll leave BrainKing. I prefer play in Ludoteka.com. There, I can play Classic (Spanish) checkers, anglo-american checkers, International checkers, Russian checkers, Italian chechers, Pool checkers, Turkish checkers (with true rules), Thain checkers and Frisian checkers.Besides, I prefer play in real time.
Like Fencer said: “BrainKing is not afraid of a competition, so feel free to visit other game sites and compare them with us :-)”. OK Fencer, for me Ludoteka is better than BrainKing. http://www.ludoteka.com/juegos.html?hizk=en

Gabriel Almeida: Here i would agree more with Ferjo, that we should be more patient. The prob on this site were the instable connections in the last days, and it's clear that this would have priority. Now the connection to Brainking is working as good as ever, and the next things on fencer's Todo-List would be done, hopeful some work in rule-description included.

Ferjo: When it is allowed that one can make a second
Brainking account, for family members or whatever, then our prob can be solved easily: we create simply a second account, and play nonrated Turkish Checkers games with our first account, so we can check up by experience which rule is appended and which is not,
without have to get this experience by surprise in a rated game.

Oh, and by the way... I think this is the mais reason why so many checkers players that used to play a lot here, may be found in another games site (I will not say it's name, but almost all of you, checkers players, know it). People it's moving away, and it's paying to play in this other site (like I've done), because there, people likes checkers. And for that reason, it have thousands for that game. Yes, this can be also business, Fencer. Can't you see it?

Ferjo: I think you and Atila are absolutely right. Atila, I think Fencer's problem is not with Turkish people, but with checkers in general. Well, there are other sites where checkers (Portuguese/Spanish/Classic, Turkish, Internacional, Russian... all "serious" variants) are well treated. But it's not the case in Brainking. So many people concerns about advising Fencer to pay more atention to it... In that point, I disagree with you, Ferjo: I don't think it ever changes. Fencer simply hates checkers, will never pay atention to it. I think it's unuseful keepin'on waiting...