(V): You dont need God to be spiritual

Czuch: Nope.. you don't. But you need to be able to touch your spiritual side through whichever system or way you find good for you.

Zen is good, Buddhism also

(V):but how does a quote from the bible, lend any true weight to your arguement?

Bwild: Because some things never change, or slowly. We've still not beaten the corruption problem within our governments, hence the quote.

... It's just an example.

Likewise.. Another quote. "Democracy is not perfect, but it's the best system of government so far."

(V):I like Franklins version better        politics is to wolves telling a sheep what to do....liberty is a well armed sheep,willing to negotiate....

Bwild: Or.... " a people should not be afraid of it's government, the government should be afraid of it's people."

Czuch: "You dont need God to be spiritual"

No argument here. We actually agree again. (gulp)

I think organized religion is often the antithesis of true spirituality. And Bwild is right, all these scriptures have been doctored, not to mention mistranslated to support various dogmas.

But they still have value. And it doesn't mean, for example, that Jesus the "Christ" or Gautama the "Buddha" didn't teach some of the most sublime truths, or live them.

One shouldn't swallow the whole turkey, nor throw out the baby with the bathwater. "There is no religion higher than Truth," says H.P. Blavatsky. But truth is not only mundane, but also divine.

Only a little reflection tells us that the physical universe, of which our bodies & world are composed, is only the tip of the iceberg.

The Usurper: Doctored..... yes in the respect that much was left out to 'compile' the Bible... Changed... Yep, but in the matter of interpretation.

.... Yet, if one really studies and goes back to the roots, to the early days before the 'Bible' was formed as a step to organise Christianity, there is much to see.

Quite frankly, in America religion has become too much of a business. Some 'preachers' live to good a life I feel, liking the money rather then true saving.

Maybe they should try the Eastern style... They own nothing and the community provides their alms.