TheCrazyPuppy: We've had a gang culture for years.. Remember the Crays. Nothing new about that. And the amount of stabbings seems to be dropping.

And no.. Inner city people do not live in fear, in some places it may be bad, but to say that it's all bad is an over exaggeration. And in some respects, it's starting to rekindle the community spirit that we lost under Thatcher. eg.. where we live they use to before we moved here quite a problem with yobs.... But the community got together with the police and courts and sorted them out.

Now... it's very peaceful here.

And of certain areas, the problem rises from old style housing, as in too many people in a small area. Most councils are now getting tearing down such housing estates and going back to more relaxed housing systems that encourage a more peaceful life for the residents.

Things are changing for the better. But Rome was not built over night!!

(V): But Rome was not built over night!!

You expect perfection, you expect things to fixed in 5 seconds flat.

Unrealistic.



My how your opinions seem to vary based on the circumstances....

Those are some of the exact same messages I have tried to use in regards to Iraq.... where you and many others have consistently over the years have complained how the US has made Iraq worse, and "where is this so called wonderful democracy" in Iraq etc etc.... I have always maintained that some things take time, even decades to change, and sometimes they get worse before they get better, and that the Iraqi people will not see, feel or appreciate (many of them) their new democracy (or democratic ways) for a generation or two.

But for you and your like minded buddies, its always been naysaying naysaying naysaying..... just try to remember..... Rome was not built overnight

Czuch: Czuch.... I you remember my concerns with Iraq, off the reconstruction it was because of the lack of a plan.. which your Government of the time freely admits from what I remember. And if you feel it'll take decades for Iraq to be stable, then I feel sorry for the troops who will die from the lack of planning.

As the old saying goes "Victorious soldiers win first then go to battle, others just go to battle and hope to win." (paraphrased as I can't remember the exact wording )

Also one of my concerns was the need, I find it strange that Bin Laden and the Taliban did not get the attention Iraq got in terms of troops and logistics. That war would probably be over now, the one to get those who planned and executed 911!!!!

And if you feel things take time, then give your current Admin more time, unless you feel that they are wrong and their plans just won't work, or are ill thought out.

But.. the current feeling in the EU is that it'll be some time before we see daylight from this recession.

(V): unless you feel that they are wrong and their plans just won't work, or are ill thought out.


I think they are ill thought out really....

If you print me a million dollars, I am sure that I can manage to work things out for a few years


Sure we can pump trillions of dollars into the economy and sure that will make things better, at least in the short term (several years maybe) But then what? You might say it is just a shot in the arm, to keep us going until things turn around? All good, except that things will turn around on their own anyway, and without putting us in debt and turning the autos and the banks and the health etc, all over for the government to run.


I love to listen to the people who always complained about the lack of federal response to Katrina and other complaints about the federal government. Yet those are the same people who would willingly put so much more responsibility into the hands of the very same federal government?

Reagan said it best.... the government cant solve our problems, they are the problem!

I think that in 50 years it will be the same argument about this recession, and how it was handled, as the great depression is today.

Nobody today can agree if it was the government stimulus, or if that really made it actually take longer to recover than doing nothing?

Czuch: I think a lot of government systems need..... .... tweaking. And I'm being very understated there!!

As to Katrina... I'm sorry, but your emergency response system seems to have too much red tape. If I get the gist of the delay right.

I don't think the government is the problem.. It's the politics involved that are causing the problem. Too much bickering, worrying about getting re-elected, etc, etc....

As to in 50 years time... it'll be part of history.. as you say.. it will be talked about

(V): I don't think the government is the problem.. It's the politics involved that are causing the problem. Too much bickering, worrying about getting re-elected, etc, etc....

I'm sorry, but your emergency response system seems to have too much red tape.




Government is politics, and the red tape intertwined into the emergency response system, that is also systemic of the government. The whole government has too much red tape and other pitfalls..... look at our IRS tax codes etc.... Thats exactly what you will get when the government runs our autos and our health and anything else they run

There is no reason for me to believe they will be any better at doing these things than they are at the FEMA (federal emergency management agency) or most anything else they currently run right now.

Czuch: No, that's what we've allowed it to become. It's time our Governments were fully audited.

And I want Alan Sugar to go over and re-organise the Government here.

As recently reported over here, our 'leaders' have been taking the mickey (again another word is better but PG rating. ) over expenses. It makes me sick that they have been living on the gravy train whilst people are struggling ... But a full report is in place.. Something certain politicians don't want, but the opposition parties as well as members of the Labour party are behind the review.

I mean, an MP rips off the country for over £200k and only has to pay back less then £50k... That's not right!!

(V): In both parties. I'm sick of the Republicans as much as the Democrats.

Artful Dodger: It's not only them.. it's the civil servants as well that help keep it going.