Sandoz:
I appreciate the attention given in discussing this issue by both the players and staff including any in opposition to my proposal.
You are correct that this forum is a big plus for this site.

Dark Prince: with no volcanoes a 50 rules is reasonable. however with volcanoes it should be more than that. I regularly have games that take about 100 before a piece is taken from the board, its just how the game is played.

i dont think a 50 move rule should be worded like chess but perhaps 50 moves without advancement. perhaps a like chinese checkers where all pieces need to be at a certain point by a certain move. you need to advance to a specific rank on the board. Forcing a move forward. This would work best for non volcano games. and perhaps a similar rule for the volcano games. I'm in a game with Mark now that is about move 30 and no one has taken a piece or revealed a piece yet. This will take about another 50-100 more moves until the game gets "started". It's far from over/drawn. a draw rule does need to be implemented, i can agree with that.

Nothingness:
" I'm in a game with Mark now that is about move 30 and no one has taken a piece or revealed a piece yet. This will take about another 50-100 more moves until the game gets "started".

You spoke too soon... just moved forwarded and I can see you! Still no capture, though this will surely follow soon. As you are white, thought I would make the first move and save you the embarressment of having to offer a draw, which I would have refused anyway

SL-Mark:
The advantage of such a rule is that, if refused and the indicated number of moves has been reached without a capture, it could then be enforced even though the opponent refused the offer.

I don't think advancement to some particular rank indicates enough of an advantage to justify it as a measuring stick in the draw issue. It would create difficulties in verification and possibly allow a temporary advancement. Whatever the number of moves, I think the capture of a piece by either player must be the criteria.
To allow for slow starters, the 50 move rule could start at move 25 and the 35 move rule for smaller boards could start at move 15 for the open variations.
50 moves starting at move 50 and 35 moves starting at move 30 for the volcano variations.

Chaos: 50 moves for each player or 25+25 moves = 50

Nothingness: I assumed 50 moves = 50 moves for each player.

Chaos:
In chess, the 50 move rule is 50 moves for each player.
That being the standard, it is implied unless stated otherwise. If one player makes 50 moves and the other had made only 49 since the last capture, the latter could prevent the draw rule taking effect by capturing that move. In any case, if a capture is not made and neither player invokes the draw rule, the game continues. The draw rule could be invoked any move thereafter until a capture is made. Once a capture is made without the draw rule being invoked, the 50 move rule starts over notwithstanding it could have been previously called a draw. That is to say, if a player wants to invoke the 50 move draw rule, it must be done both after 50 moves without a capture and before a capture is made.
A sapper deactivating a bomb is considered a capture.

Dark Prince:
If the player to make move #50 wants to call it a draw and 50 moves by the opponent were already made without a capture, that player may invoke the draw rule before moving by stating the intention of not making a capture on that move. It must be clear, however, that the move choices available do not require any piece to move onto a square occupied by an enemy piece.

Offering a draw to the opponent under those conditions is considered invoking the draw rule even if the opponent refuses the offer. I would hope that support would be able to verify that the offer had been made. If that's not the case, and the opponent declines or doesn't respond to the offer quickly, the player wanting to invoke the rule should inform support before moving, and then move to avoid timing out.

Dark Prince: we also should take into account that a suicide attack should count for a capture of a piece. thus resetting the 50 move count.

Nothingness:
Above the opponent's side of the board there is a "Captured pieces:" list with the identities if those pieces the opponent has captured, and below one's own side of the board board there is a "Captured pieces:" list with the identities if those pieces you captured and "?" for unidentified captured pieces. Pieces show up on the list whether captured by successful attack or unsuccessful attack. Any time a piece is moved to a square occupied by an enemy piece, one of those pieces will be captured.
There is no capture on a move that the pieces moved all move to unoccupied squares.
Sorry for not properly linking my previous post.

Chaos:
I personally think that a starting point for the 50 move/35 move draw rule should be at the first move of the game but don't have a major problem if it's later.
If that starting move is different for different variations, it could be addressed in the specific rules for those variations.
If no draw rule is addressed in the game rules any time soon, perhaps an agreement list could be made once those draw rules are ironed out.

Dark Prince: Starting at the first move of the game puts an immediate damper on the aspect of defense. You have to start attacking without backup. Sometimes revealing pieces early in the game requires time to resetting your pieces and placing them in the correct strategic position. This can take some time. Redeployment is something that can take quite a few moves as not to reveal too much by immediately moving the strong pieces. I think that a fair total would be about 15-20 moves into the game. Also there are certain volcano setups that aren't conducive to attacking and some are easier. What about these?

Nothingness:
Yeah, that's cool.
In fact, I think I was the one to first suggest a starting point even though my preference is move #1. Maybe Chaos will create a list once concrete numbers are ironed out. You suggested move 20 if I read correctly for Open Fast. What do you suggest for other variations?
Do we agree on a 50 move rule for the 10x10 variations and 35 for the 8x8 variations?
Will the volcano variations be the same with only the starting move yet to be determined?

Dark Prince: That is difficult to say. The volcano variants are traditionally slower. i think that your suggestions seems reasonable. although for small volcano versions 50+20 is still short and will change the game on an elite level. it is reasonable though. I wish that the rating system would be tweaked for forced draws.

Nothingness:
A win is a win regardless of how quickly it's accomplished.
A loss is a loss regardless of how well played.
A draw is a draw whether agreed or enforced.
Even if a reasonable argument could be made to tweak the rating change for such a draw, I have no reason to think support would tweak it and doubt it would be a simple task to do so.

Dark Prince: well i disagree with your first 3 statements a win is a win etc.. but i do agree it would not be a simple task and thus not feasible.

Nothingness:
What is the basis of your disagreement?
The basis of my statement is on how rating systems work.
My statement does not apply to the entertainment value of an exciting game vs. an hum drum game.